1 00:00:01,520 --> 00:00:04,840 (helicopter propellers) 2 00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:07,000 Downloaded from YTS.MX 3 00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:13,000 Official YIFY movies site: YTS.MX 4 00:00:15,200 --> 00:00:17,960 (camera shutter) 5 00:00:25,240 --> 00:00:27,960 (camera shutter) 6 00:01:14,760 --> 00:01:16,680 - How you doing, all right? - Yeah, how about you? 7 00:01:16,760 --> 00:01:18,360 - Yeah, good, mate. 8 00:01:20,080 --> 00:01:23,120 Pretty much standard procedure, if you've got suspected IDs, 9 00:01:23,200 --> 00:01:24,480 even though you're clearing it, 10 00:01:24,560 --> 00:01:25,680 you want to walk in the footsteps 11 00:01:25,760 --> 00:01:26,640 of the person in front of you. 12 00:01:26,720 --> 00:01:28,240 If they've stepped on that patch 13 00:01:28,320 --> 00:01:29,400 and it hasn't triggered anything, 14 00:01:29,480 --> 00:01:32,640 there's a good chance that that's a safe bit of ground. 15 00:01:32,720 --> 00:01:35,000 But of course if you pause for even a fraction of a second 16 00:01:35,080 --> 00:01:36,640 to frame up and take an image, 17 00:01:36,720 --> 00:01:38,440 you're not looking where their feet went. 18 00:01:38,520 --> 00:01:40,720 And so, now this is a very demanding job, 19 00:01:40,800 --> 00:01:42,840 requires a lot of concentration 20 00:01:42,920 --> 00:01:45,720 and a lot of fear management as well. 21 00:01:45,800 --> 00:01:47,960 And you just reach the point where you're like, 22 00:01:48,040 --> 00:01:49,560 there's only so much I can do, 23 00:01:49,640 --> 00:01:51,600 I have to trust that that guy in front 24 00:01:51,680 --> 00:01:54,680 is picking up any traces if there are any devices here. 25 00:02:45,480 --> 00:02:47,800 (explosion) 26 00:05:32,040 --> 00:05:34,560 (gunfire) 27 00:05:34,640 --> 00:05:36,560 - Jeremy get down in there, get down there! 28 00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:39,400 (camera shutter) 29 00:05:50,360 --> 00:05:52,680 (crackling) 30 00:06:05,680 --> 00:06:09,960 (intense instrumental music) 31 00:06:10,040 --> 00:06:12,400 - Colombia is one of the most dangerous countries 32 00:06:12,480 --> 00:06:14,640 in the world, for decades it's been ravaged 33 00:06:14,720 --> 00:06:17,280 by political violence, drug cartels of course, 34 00:06:17,360 --> 00:06:19,600 and human rights violations. 35 00:06:19,720 --> 00:06:22,600 Photojournalist Jason Howe has spent several years 36 00:06:22,680 --> 00:06:24,680 documenting the civil war there. 37 00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:28,080 - Colombia was the big learning experience, 38 00:06:28,160 --> 00:06:31,080 the place that I had gone to to try and 39 00:06:31,160 --> 00:06:33,320 learn how to be a photojournalist, 40 00:06:33,400 --> 00:06:38,080 to learn the skills involved in telling a story in pictures, 41 00:06:38,160 --> 00:06:39,520 gaining access to people. 42 00:06:39,600 --> 00:06:41,960 So it was very different from the travel photography 43 00:06:42,040 --> 00:06:44,160 that I'd done before, which was all about, you know, 44 00:06:44,240 --> 00:06:47,200 blue sky, sun behind you, beautiful landscape. 45 00:06:47,280 --> 00:06:49,320 This was gonna be a lot more difficult. 46 00:06:54,200 --> 00:06:55,880 The first area that I started working 47 00:06:55,960 --> 00:06:58,760 was down in San Vicente del Caguan, 48 00:06:58,840 --> 00:07:02,280 which is the town that the FARC controlled, 49 00:07:02,360 --> 00:07:04,600 in a demilitarised done that the government 50 00:07:04,680 --> 00:07:08,200 had pulled out from to allow them to negotiate there. 51 00:07:12,560 --> 00:07:14,400 The peace process was very shaky, 52 00:07:14,480 --> 00:07:16,640 and they told me that this isn't a good time, 53 00:07:16,720 --> 00:07:19,160 if the situation changes we'll come and let you know, 54 00:07:19,240 --> 00:07:21,600 and then you can visit us in the camp. 55 00:07:21,680 --> 00:07:25,240 Now, given that I had quit my job, 56 00:07:25,320 --> 00:07:28,520 sold off my remaining possessions, 57 00:07:28,600 --> 00:07:31,840 I couldn't allow that initial rebuff 58 00:07:31,920 --> 00:07:34,880 to be the end of the story. 59 00:07:34,960 --> 00:07:36,560 I explained to them, I explained the situation, 60 00:07:36,640 --> 00:07:38,480 explained the things that I'd given up 61 00:07:38,560 --> 00:07:40,600 and the fact that I wanted to dedicate my time now 62 00:07:40,680 --> 00:07:44,040 to telling their story was how I put it over at the time. 63 00:07:44,960 --> 00:07:47,280 So I spent the next couple of weeks 64 00:07:47,360 --> 00:07:51,040 sleeping 100 metres away from their camp. 65 00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:55,360 Suddenly the FARC started becoming a little friendlier, 66 00:07:55,440 --> 00:07:57,600 and then as this moved on, eventually one day they said, 67 00:07:57,680 --> 00:07:59,160 oh, you might as well just move your stuff over 68 00:07:59,240 --> 00:08:00,680 and move into the camp. 69 00:08:01,640 --> 00:08:02,800 So I've got to the point where they would 70 00:08:02,920 --> 00:08:04,800 stop thinking of me as a journalist, 71 00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:06,720 this person that was in their faces, 72 00:08:06,800 --> 00:08:08,920 and I'd become this person who was kind of in the background 73 00:08:09,000 --> 00:08:10,560 that they could kind of get on with their lives 74 00:08:10,640 --> 00:08:12,120 and do what they needed to do. 75 00:08:14,800 --> 00:08:17,520 There was a young couple I spent quite a bit of time with, 76 00:08:17,600 --> 00:08:20,200 a guy called Bernardo and his girlfriend Marisol. 77 00:08:20,280 --> 00:08:22,360 We walked around the camp one evening 78 00:08:22,440 --> 00:08:23,400 and they stopped and kissed, 79 00:08:23,480 --> 00:08:25,920 they shot me a sort of little shy, 80 00:08:26,880 --> 00:08:29,120 glance, half smile, and moved on. 81 00:08:30,160 --> 00:08:32,360 After a while the peace process completely broke down 82 00:08:32,440 --> 00:08:34,880 and the government gave the FARC 24 hours 83 00:08:34,960 --> 00:08:37,720 to evacuate the zone before they would come in 84 00:08:37,800 --> 00:08:39,880 and take it back by force. 85 00:08:41,320 --> 00:08:44,520 As the FARC had left their zone of control 86 00:08:44,600 --> 00:08:47,400 and the military were coming in to retake the zone, 87 00:08:47,480 --> 00:08:51,680 they had set an ambush, which were two buses and a truck, 88 00:08:51,760 --> 00:08:55,040 and one of the buses had a message painted on the side 89 00:08:55,120 --> 00:08:59,000 saying that it had explosives on board. 90 00:08:59,080 --> 00:09:01,840 They sent a few men ahead to basically diffuse the bomb, 91 00:09:01,920 --> 00:09:03,960 was the idea, I thought perhaps they would walk up 92 00:09:04,040 --> 00:09:06,320 and just roll a grenade under it, blow the thing up, 93 00:09:06,400 --> 00:09:09,000 it's safe, and on we can go. 94 00:09:09,080 --> 00:09:11,400 The soldiers were walking around, kicking the tyres, 95 00:09:11,480 --> 00:09:13,880 they got in, tried the ignition. 96 00:09:13,960 --> 00:09:16,680 Not techniques that I think are approved 97 00:09:16,760 --> 00:09:19,160 by many bomb disposal squads. 98 00:09:19,240 --> 00:09:20,600 I walked away and I'd been gone 99 00:09:20,680 --> 00:09:22,680 probably not more than 30 seconds, 100 00:09:22,760 --> 00:09:25,280 maybe a minute at most, and I was about 15 metres away 101 00:09:25,360 --> 00:09:26,600 when there was a large explosion. 102 00:09:26,720 --> 00:09:28,520 (explosion) 103 00:09:28,640 --> 00:09:30,920 I ran round the bus through the smoke 104 00:09:31,000 --> 00:09:32,200 expecting to see the soldiers 105 00:09:32,280 --> 00:09:35,360 that I'd been with for a few hours standing at a distance, 106 00:09:35,440 --> 00:09:39,760 laughing and pointing and saying they had found the bomb. 107 00:09:39,840 --> 00:09:42,720 But instead what I was confronted with 108 00:09:42,800 --> 00:09:45,520 was three bodies laying on the ground, 109 00:09:45,600 --> 00:09:49,240 looking to me to be pretty obviously dead. 110 00:09:49,320 --> 00:09:52,360 It occurred to me immediately that I had 111 00:09:52,440 --> 00:09:55,200 very narrowly escaped being killed by that explosion, 112 00:09:55,280 --> 00:09:57,120 by a matter of a few metres. 113 00:09:59,880 --> 00:10:02,600 I then walked over to this other heap in the road 114 00:10:02,680 --> 00:10:05,280 which was two bodies, and then all of a sudden, 115 00:10:05,360 --> 00:10:10,360 the body on top groaned, and his eyes came up and met mine. 116 00:10:10,560 --> 00:10:13,960 I sort of froze, I didn't really know what to do. 117 00:10:14,040 --> 00:10:15,560 All of a sudden I wasn't just photographing a dead body, 118 00:10:15,640 --> 00:10:18,000 I was photographing someone in pain, 119 00:10:18,080 --> 00:10:20,080 someone that was suffering. 120 00:10:20,160 --> 00:10:21,400 My hands were still shaking, 121 00:10:21,480 --> 00:10:24,040 and I was realising in some ways that this was the big test, 122 00:10:24,120 --> 00:10:26,560 this was the, okay, you want to be a war photographer, 123 00:10:26,640 --> 00:10:29,400 you want to witness these serious situations 124 00:10:29,480 --> 00:10:32,280 and take pictures to show other people, here is your test. 125 00:10:32,360 --> 00:10:34,920 If you can handle this, maybe you'll be able to do it. 126 00:10:35,000 --> 00:10:37,080 If you can't, if you're gonna walk around feeling sick 127 00:10:37,160 --> 00:10:40,080 or going into shock, or you don't take any pictures, then, 128 00:10:40,160 --> 00:10:42,680 you've failed, give up. 129 00:10:43,960 --> 00:10:47,280 - The whole idea and the term war photographer 130 00:10:47,360 --> 00:10:49,000 I find pretty ridiculous now. 131 00:10:49,080 --> 00:10:51,280 But you know, when you're in your early 20s 132 00:10:51,360 --> 00:10:53,200 and you're trying to get your war on 133 00:10:53,280 --> 00:10:55,560 and make pictures, you're like, yeah. 134 00:10:55,640 --> 00:10:56,960 (gunfire) 135 00:10:57,040 --> 00:10:59,120 Hell yeah! 136 00:10:59,200 --> 00:11:01,960 (gunfire) 137 00:11:02,040 --> 00:11:03,400 (explosion) 138 00:11:03,480 --> 00:11:04,680 Woo! 139 00:11:04,760 --> 00:11:08,560 I met Jason in Colombia I believe in the year 2000. 140 00:11:08,640 --> 00:11:10,760 And we got on well right from the start. 141 00:11:10,840 --> 00:11:14,480 I mean I thought he was kind of a maniac and an idiot, but, 142 00:11:14,560 --> 00:11:16,440 I loved him for it immediately. 143 00:11:16,520 --> 00:11:20,320 It's a type of maniacal idiocrasy that you just 144 00:11:20,400 --> 00:11:21,160 fall in love with. (laughing) 145 00:11:21,240 --> 00:11:24,200 - Me and Eros and are trying to figure out where to go 146 00:11:24,280 --> 00:11:26,040 and then somebody said oh, there's this other guy 147 00:11:26,120 --> 00:11:28,480 who's also a freelancer, he's interested in going. 148 00:11:28,560 --> 00:11:31,080 So he came over and we sat down and had a few drinks, 149 00:11:31,160 --> 00:11:32,720 looked at some pictures, talked about a plan, 150 00:11:32,800 --> 00:11:34,600 and we all came up with a, 151 00:11:34,680 --> 00:11:35,520 (laughs) 152 00:11:35,600 --> 00:11:36,800 It's a plan, I don't know if it's a good plan or not, 153 00:11:36,880 --> 00:11:39,560 but we came up with a plan, and that's how we met. 154 00:11:39,640 --> 00:11:41,360 - So a week later we happened to be back down 155 00:11:41,440 --> 00:11:43,960 in the same region on the same road that the FARC controlled 156 00:11:44,040 --> 00:11:47,080 when we came to a roadblock. 157 00:11:47,160 --> 00:11:48,800 - And we walked up to the FARC commander, 158 00:11:48,880 --> 00:11:50,600 whoever was in charge there, and said, can we take pictures? 159 00:11:50,680 --> 00:11:52,240 He was just like, looked at us going like, 160 00:11:52,320 --> 00:11:53,880 yeah, what are you asking me? 161 00:11:53,960 --> 00:11:56,440 Like, I'm trying to do something else here. 162 00:11:56,520 --> 00:11:59,280 - The FARC had all of the civilians laying down 163 00:11:59,360 --> 00:12:01,680 crouching in the road in between their vehicles. 164 00:12:01,760 --> 00:12:03,680 - It was honestly a very cynical technique 165 00:12:03,760 --> 00:12:05,360 because the guerrillas ended up basically 166 00:12:05,440 --> 00:12:07,240 using the civilians as human shields 167 00:12:07,320 --> 00:12:10,200 so that there wouldn't be airstrikes against them. 168 00:12:10,280 --> 00:12:13,240 - And then in the distance to see these government soldiers 169 00:12:13,320 --> 00:12:14,920 coming running across the river, 170 00:12:15,000 --> 00:12:18,760 it was a very sort of Vietnam-y kind of feel to the scene. 171 00:12:18,840 --> 00:12:22,880 - It was the first firefight that any of us had been in. 172 00:12:22,960 --> 00:12:25,520 We'd certainly been in situations that were dodgy enough, 173 00:12:25,600 --> 00:12:27,200 but this was a proper gunfight. 174 00:12:27,280 --> 00:12:28,640 - There were people trying to get white flags, 175 00:12:28,720 --> 00:12:30,760 trying to make sure they weren't getting shot at. 176 00:12:30,840 --> 00:12:32,680 But then the shooting getting more intense and more intense 177 00:12:32,760 --> 00:12:34,080 as their army got closer and closer. 178 00:12:34,160 --> 00:12:35,880 People are starting to run into this field 179 00:12:36,000 --> 00:12:37,760 to take cover in just some high grass, 180 00:12:37,880 --> 00:12:38,840 'cause there was really nowhere to hide. 181 00:12:38,920 --> 00:12:40,560 And the FARCs sort of took cover on the other side. 182 00:12:40,640 --> 00:12:43,200 Eros and I went with the civilians, photographed them, 183 00:12:43,280 --> 00:12:45,360 and Jason went with the FARC soldiers. 184 00:12:45,440 --> 00:12:47,360 And that kinda shows you a little bit sort of where 185 00:12:47,440 --> 00:12:48,920 he was going, where we're all sort of looking at 186 00:12:49,000 --> 00:12:49,880 different parts of the conflict, 187 00:12:49,960 --> 00:12:52,200 within the same scene you're looking at different things. 188 00:12:52,280 --> 00:12:53,840 - It didn't really feel dangerous, 189 00:12:53,920 --> 00:12:55,120 it felt incredibly exciting. 190 00:12:55,200 --> 00:12:57,560 And I'm sure the civilians must've thought 191 00:12:58,400 --> 00:13:00,280 we were utter lunatics. 192 00:13:00,360 --> 00:13:02,200 - They were shooting, I don't even know how long, 193 00:13:02,280 --> 00:13:04,080 it could've been -- - Maybe a half hour or so. 194 00:13:04,160 --> 00:13:05,480 - Three hours, I really don't know. 195 00:13:05,560 --> 00:13:08,280 - Maybe it was five minutes, it's hard to remember really, 196 00:13:08,360 --> 00:13:09,200 you're in the middle of it. 197 00:13:09,280 --> 00:13:10,440 - You could tell the army was getting closer 198 00:13:10,520 --> 00:13:12,160 and the FARC was kind of getting away. 199 00:13:12,240 --> 00:13:13,320 - All of a sudden I found I was alone, 200 00:13:13,400 --> 00:13:15,480 they had gone and left me. 201 00:13:15,560 --> 00:13:16,520 And so the only person that the soldiers 202 00:13:16,600 --> 00:13:18,400 were shooting at now was me. 203 00:13:18,480 --> 00:13:19,680 - We're like, Jason! 204 00:13:19,760 --> 00:13:20,480 Jason! 205 00:13:20,560 --> 00:13:22,080 He's like what, what? 206 00:13:22,160 --> 00:13:23,640 And we're like, you're about to get shot. 207 00:13:23,720 --> 00:13:26,600 - And I didn't really notice or feel any of this 208 00:13:26,680 --> 00:13:28,480 until I got close to the grass and saw the dirt 209 00:13:28,560 --> 00:13:30,440 and the grass flying up as the bullets hit it. 210 00:13:30,520 --> 00:13:32,800 - So then at some point he, we don't see him, 211 00:13:32,880 --> 00:13:34,160 we're like uh-oh, did he just get shot? 212 00:13:34,240 --> 00:13:35,400 And then we see him crawling back to us 213 00:13:35,480 --> 00:13:38,200 with a big grin on his face. (laughing) 214 00:13:38,280 --> 00:13:42,560 - We went back to San Vicente, where life was pretty normal, 215 00:13:42,640 --> 00:13:45,360 and got drunk, and then the next day, 216 00:13:46,520 --> 00:13:48,880 we're like, yeah, we're gonna go out 217 00:13:48,960 --> 00:13:51,360 and find this shit again, man, like hell yeah. 218 00:13:51,440 --> 00:13:55,160 We're combat photographers now, we can do it. 219 00:13:55,240 --> 00:13:56,880 We were totally hungover. 220 00:14:06,600 --> 00:14:11,160 - More than 20 years ago I read Tim Page's autobiography, 221 00:14:11,240 --> 00:14:12,920 a book called Page After Page. 222 00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:17,480 It was probably my first introduction to 223 00:14:17,560 --> 00:14:21,560 the life of a photojournalist or a war photographer. 224 00:14:21,640 --> 00:14:22,760 And it was very exciting, 225 00:14:22,840 --> 00:14:25,560 at that stage I had never even been trampling, 226 00:14:25,640 --> 00:14:29,000 certainly never even left England at that point. 227 00:14:30,160 --> 00:14:32,720 (road traffic) 228 00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:39,640 And then I happened to meet him, 229 00:14:39,720 --> 00:14:41,480 and I was a little bit shocked 230 00:14:41,560 --> 00:14:45,760 by the way he was describing war and the glamour of war, 231 00:14:45,840 --> 00:14:49,440 and kind of admitting that he found it exciting, 232 00:14:49,520 --> 00:14:51,920 and that it was a big adventure and all that kind of thing. 233 00:14:52,000 --> 00:14:53,280 Whereas, (dog barking) 234 00:14:53,360 --> 00:14:54,760 that's something that a lot of photographers 235 00:14:54,840 --> 00:14:58,640 are very afraid to admit that they actually quite enjoy, 236 00:14:58,720 --> 00:15:01,600 and get a big sort of thrill and buzz from it. 237 00:15:01,680 --> 00:15:05,440 - Vietnam was an absolute, it was a marvellous place. 238 00:15:05,520 --> 00:15:07,880 Not for the Vietnamese to be in the middle of it, 239 00:15:07,960 --> 00:15:10,720 but in terms of war, what a great session. 240 00:15:10,800 --> 00:15:13,240 One minute you're in a muddy foxhole 241 00:15:13,320 --> 00:15:15,320 in the middle of Woop Woop being shot the shit of, 242 00:15:15,400 --> 00:15:18,480 and the next minute you're back on a beach on a surfboard. 243 00:15:18,560 --> 00:15:22,040 There was no compromise, it was all or nothing. 244 00:15:22,120 --> 00:15:25,360 It was incredibly exciting and very fulfilling, 245 00:15:25,440 --> 00:15:26,600 you're not empty. 246 00:15:27,600 --> 00:15:29,440 It's not a boring life. 247 00:15:29,520 --> 00:15:32,440 (gunfire) 248 00:15:32,520 --> 00:15:36,240 You've still got fear, but you can press it back in. 249 00:15:36,320 --> 00:15:39,560 Time becomes this elastic module. 250 00:15:39,640 --> 00:15:44,280 You don't know if this incident, this part of the operation, 251 00:15:44,360 --> 00:15:47,200 this part of the fight, this part of the battle, 252 00:15:47,280 --> 00:15:51,280 has actually lasted seconds, minutes, or hours. 253 00:15:51,360 --> 00:15:54,000 (intense music) 254 00:15:55,000 --> 00:15:58,000 - After the first six months spent in Colombia, 255 00:15:58,080 --> 00:16:02,320 I printed up some of the better images 256 00:16:02,400 --> 00:16:06,200 and I decided to go to Perpignan in the south of France, 257 00:16:06,280 --> 00:16:08,720 where there is an annual photojournalism festival 258 00:16:08,800 --> 00:16:10,760 called Visa pour l'Image. 259 00:16:10,840 --> 00:16:13,720 - It's like our equivalent of Cannes, for a journalist, 260 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:16,720 and everybody kind of gathers all the way around the world 261 00:16:16,800 --> 00:16:19,400 and if you're on assignment and you're done, 262 00:16:19,480 --> 00:16:21,240 we all just go there and we all just get drunk. 263 00:16:21,320 --> 00:16:23,920 - And I walked into a bar and -- 264 00:16:24,000 --> 00:16:26,040 - And it was early hours in the morning, 265 00:16:26,120 --> 00:16:27,760 and I came across Jason. 266 00:16:27,840 --> 00:16:30,120 - Somehow ended up in conversation with this 267 00:16:30,200 --> 00:16:33,000 slightly inebriated Irishman 268 00:16:33,080 --> 00:16:36,280 who turned out to be Seamus Conlin. 269 00:16:36,360 --> 00:16:38,600 - He was just off his head and, 270 00:16:38,680 --> 00:16:40,840 and he showed me his pictures, 271 00:16:40,920 --> 00:16:44,760 and it was of the Colombia bombing. 272 00:16:45,720 --> 00:16:49,600 And that was when I made the decision to actually, 273 00:16:49,680 --> 00:16:52,080 actually be his agent. 274 00:16:52,160 --> 00:16:54,880 And to represent him, because I knew he had something. 275 00:16:56,520 --> 00:16:59,120 - After spending time with the FARC 276 00:16:59,200 --> 00:17:02,040 and realising that I couldn't with a clear conscience 277 00:17:02,120 --> 00:17:04,480 just document their side of the story, 278 00:17:04,560 --> 00:17:06,480 because it would effectively end up 279 00:17:06,560 --> 00:17:09,040 just being propaganda for them. 280 00:17:09,120 --> 00:17:10,800 The only things that I was really seeing with the FARC 281 00:17:10,880 --> 00:17:12,880 were the things that they wanted me to see. 282 00:17:12,960 --> 00:17:15,200 I wasn't seeing child soldiers, 283 00:17:15,280 --> 00:17:17,880 I wasn't seeing the people that they were holding hostage 284 00:17:17,960 --> 00:17:19,640 that they had kidnapped. 285 00:17:19,720 --> 00:17:21,560 I wasn't seeing any direct involvement 286 00:17:21,640 --> 00:17:23,440 between them and the cocaine trade. 287 00:17:24,360 --> 00:17:27,760 I was seeing to a large extent, 288 00:17:27,840 --> 00:17:30,520 really, the public face of the FARC. 289 00:17:30,600 --> 00:17:32,000 My next mission really was to get down 290 00:17:32,080 --> 00:17:34,640 to try to meet the paramilitaries who 291 00:17:35,520 --> 00:17:40,520 I had really thought were the bad guys in this whole story. 292 00:17:40,600 --> 00:17:44,120 The FARC, I'd gone there with the idea 293 00:17:44,200 --> 00:17:46,120 that they were these sort of romantic revolutionaries 294 00:17:46,200 --> 00:17:47,760 fighting for the poor people, 295 00:17:48,640 --> 00:17:52,320 but having narrowly missed getting blown to pieces 296 00:17:52,400 --> 00:17:53,640 by one of their bombs, 297 00:17:53,720 --> 00:17:56,240 and then seeing the terror on the faces of the civilians 298 00:17:56,320 --> 00:17:59,800 that they claimed they're fighting for and supporting, 299 00:17:59,880 --> 00:18:04,040 that really, those illusions crumbled pretty quickly. 300 00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:07,120 So I set off to a different part of the county 301 00:18:07,200 --> 00:18:09,880 sufficiently far away that I felt 302 00:18:09,960 --> 00:18:11,960 there wouldn't be any crossover. 303 00:18:12,040 --> 00:18:13,560 Now that was quite difficult, 304 00:18:13,640 --> 00:18:14,880 because I had to go to villages 305 00:18:14,960 --> 00:18:16,480 where people couldn't tell me clearly 306 00:18:16,560 --> 00:18:17,840 whether the FARC were in control, 307 00:18:17,920 --> 00:18:19,880 or the paramilitaries were in control. 308 00:18:19,960 --> 00:18:22,080 So the technique that I found that worked 309 00:18:22,160 --> 00:18:24,640 was to always travel on local transport. 310 00:18:24,720 --> 00:18:26,160 And once you learned to communicate a bit, 311 00:18:26,240 --> 00:18:27,760 people ask you what you're doing, 312 00:18:27,840 --> 00:18:29,160 where you're going and, you know, 313 00:18:29,240 --> 00:18:31,120 you can pick up bits of information. 314 00:18:31,200 --> 00:18:34,080 But I was sitting next to this girl on the local bus. 315 00:18:34,160 --> 00:18:35,320 She was very young, I don't, 316 00:18:35,400 --> 00:18:37,760 can't really tell exactly how young she was. 317 00:18:38,680 --> 00:18:40,120 Pretty face. 318 00:18:40,200 --> 00:18:42,760 Pretty much ignoring me completely. 319 00:18:42,840 --> 00:18:46,560 And as we were driving along 320 00:18:46,640 --> 00:18:48,440 we started to approach a military checkpoint, 321 00:18:48,520 --> 00:18:51,880 and I saw that she was kind of glancing around 322 00:18:52,000 --> 00:18:53,600 and looking a little bit scared. 323 00:18:53,720 --> 00:18:56,200 So I didn't want to actually point the camera at her 324 00:18:56,280 --> 00:18:58,680 and take a picture so I just focused it on 325 00:18:58,760 --> 00:19:00,800 a metre away, which is roughly how far she was, 326 00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:03,400 preset the exposure, and so then I just clicked, 327 00:19:03,480 --> 00:19:05,880 wound, clicked, wound, just made a few frames. 328 00:19:05,960 --> 00:19:08,800 And once of them really sort of shows 329 00:19:08,880 --> 00:19:11,560 this look of concern in her eyes. 330 00:19:13,080 --> 00:19:15,560 And it's one of my favourite pictures 331 00:19:15,640 --> 00:19:18,200 of how the conflict affects the civilians. 332 00:19:19,240 --> 00:19:22,360 It was very important with this project on Colombia 333 00:19:22,440 --> 00:19:24,400 to make sure that it didn't just become 334 00:19:24,480 --> 00:19:27,160 a book of pictures of guys with guns. 335 00:19:27,240 --> 00:19:29,400 Because whilst the weapons and the conflict 336 00:19:29,480 --> 00:19:31,800 and the fighting and the fighters 337 00:19:31,880 --> 00:19:33,640 are a very important ingredient, 338 00:19:33,720 --> 00:19:36,400 the civilian population is also 339 00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:38,680 crucial to telling this story. 340 00:19:38,760 --> 00:19:42,160 (loud talking and music) 341 00:19:44,760 --> 00:19:47,360 A huge amount of access and getting images 342 00:19:47,440 --> 00:19:49,560 can just be about luck and timing. 343 00:19:49,640 --> 00:19:51,240 And sometimes that's not because you've planned that 344 00:19:51,320 --> 00:19:52,320 yourself, it's just you happen to be 345 00:19:52,400 --> 00:19:54,240 in the right place at the right time. 346 00:19:55,280 --> 00:19:57,640 I met Marylin whilst changing buses 347 00:19:57,720 --> 00:20:01,480 in one of the small town en route to a town called Pitalito. 348 00:20:02,440 --> 00:20:04,480 And we happened to get on the same bus 349 00:20:04,560 --> 00:20:06,200 and were sitting next to each other. 350 00:20:06,280 --> 00:20:08,280 My Spanish at this stage was very basic, 351 00:20:08,360 --> 00:20:11,320 but I managed to explain to her that I was a photographer 352 00:20:11,400 --> 00:20:13,880 and that I had recently spent some time in the FARC zone, 353 00:20:13,960 --> 00:20:16,040 and that the purpose of my trip south 354 00:20:16,120 --> 00:20:18,320 was to cover the other side of the conflict. 355 00:20:18,400 --> 00:20:21,440 She explained that she knew people 356 00:20:21,520 --> 00:20:22,640 who were in the paramilitaries, 357 00:20:22,720 --> 00:20:24,120 and knew people who were in the military, 358 00:20:24,200 --> 00:20:26,680 and that they would stop and buy sodas or beers 359 00:20:26,760 --> 00:20:29,000 and that kind of thing from her father's roadside store. 360 00:20:29,080 --> 00:20:31,320 And that she could kind of point me in the right direction 361 00:20:31,400 --> 00:20:33,040 for meeting up with these people. 362 00:20:34,040 --> 00:20:36,200 Right from the start she seemed to be 363 00:20:36,280 --> 00:20:41,160 a very useful person to have met, useful contact. 364 00:20:41,240 --> 00:20:44,200 She was young and she was attractive, 365 00:20:44,280 --> 00:20:49,000 and I was young and naive and off on my big adventure. 366 00:20:51,200 --> 00:20:52,080 When we first met, 367 00:20:52,160 --> 00:20:55,240 the only reason that our relationship didn't 368 00:20:57,760 --> 00:21:02,280 progress faster was the fact that she lived with her parents 369 00:21:02,360 --> 00:21:05,160 in a very basic house with paper thin walls, 370 00:21:05,240 --> 00:21:08,840 and she shared her bed with her young daughter. 371 00:21:08,920 --> 00:21:13,920 Which made making any kind of progress a little difficult. 372 00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:18,640 So over the course of several visits, 373 00:21:18,720 --> 00:21:20,560 whenever I went to see her, 374 00:21:20,640 --> 00:21:23,200 our relationship was growing a little bit 375 00:21:23,280 --> 00:21:26,040 in terms of friendship, and because my Spanish was improving 376 00:21:26,120 --> 00:21:27,760 so that we could communicate better. 377 00:21:27,840 --> 00:21:31,360 - We were down in Putumayo in way southern Colombia, 378 00:21:31,440 --> 00:21:33,280 which is one of the hottest zones, 379 00:21:33,360 --> 00:21:35,280 I mean, it's nasty down there. 380 00:21:35,360 --> 00:21:37,360 There's a lot of extreme violence. 381 00:21:37,440 --> 00:21:39,600 - We went out to her house the first time, 382 00:21:39,680 --> 00:21:41,480 we drove out from the city. 383 00:21:41,560 --> 00:21:45,000 - Swim in the river, had a very nice time with her family, 384 00:21:45,080 --> 00:21:47,240 ate, kicked back, and that was all good. 385 00:21:47,320 --> 00:21:50,720 - On one visit I asked her if it would make things easier 386 00:21:50,800 --> 00:21:53,640 if I stayed at a hotel in the nearby town 387 00:21:53,720 --> 00:21:55,400 so that she could come and stay with me, 388 00:21:55,480 --> 00:21:59,360 and it was the next morning that she decided to 389 00:21:59,440 --> 00:22:00,360 basically confess to me 390 00:22:00,480 --> 00:22:02,360 that she not only knew the paramilitaries 391 00:22:02,480 --> 00:22:05,440 but that she was actually an active participant 392 00:22:05,520 --> 00:22:06,760 in the conflict. 393 00:22:06,840 --> 00:22:10,480 - At that point we didn't really know to what extent. 394 00:22:10,560 --> 00:22:12,880 'Cause so many people work for either the guerrilla 395 00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:17,960 or the paramilitary, and in sometimes very innocuous roles. 396 00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:20,560 They might just be messengers or they, you know, 397 00:22:20,640 --> 00:22:23,120 they just listen and look, and report, 398 00:22:23,200 --> 00:22:25,720 so, she could have been anything. 399 00:22:27,480 --> 00:22:30,560 - When she elaborated on what she did, 400 00:22:30,640 --> 00:22:33,440 which, in fact, turned out really that she had 401 00:22:33,520 --> 00:22:36,680 migrated away from being a uniformed member 402 00:22:36,760 --> 00:22:40,240 of the local branch of the paramilitaries 403 00:22:40,320 --> 00:22:44,120 into working with an urban sell, 404 00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:48,080 and her job was basically to eliminate people. 405 00:22:48,160 --> 00:22:50,480 So she was effectively an assassin. 406 00:23:12,680 --> 00:23:15,360 - I don't think the issue of ethical behaviour 407 00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:17,800 or anything like that really entered into my head. 408 00:23:17,880 --> 00:23:19,720 Any doubts that I may have had in my mind 409 00:23:19,800 --> 00:23:23,800 about the situation were overridden, really, 410 00:23:23,880 --> 00:23:25,920 by the excitement of being in the situation. 411 00:23:26,000 --> 00:23:27,720 Because it was just playing out 412 00:23:27,800 --> 00:23:29,400 really like some kind of movie. 413 00:23:30,760 --> 00:23:33,920 (contemplative music) 414 00:23:37,960 --> 00:23:39,720 I decided to ask her if I could 415 00:23:39,800 --> 00:23:41,200 conduct an interview with her. 416 00:23:41,280 --> 00:23:43,520 I had the feeling that this was a story 417 00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:46,160 that she really wanted to tell, she was very keen, 418 00:23:46,240 --> 00:23:49,680 and there was no withholding of any information. 419 00:24:04,520 --> 00:24:06,760 - And in truth when I was listening to her 420 00:24:06,840 --> 00:24:08,520 answering the questions, I couldn't actually understand 421 00:24:08,600 --> 00:24:09,920 all of the finer points of it. 422 00:24:10,000 --> 00:24:14,840 It wasn't until the interview was transcribed later 423 00:24:14,920 --> 00:24:17,120 that I could actually 424 00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:21,480 start to understand how little feeling she had 425 00:24:21,560 --> 00:24:24,120 about the things that she had done, 426 00:24:24,200 --> 00:24:26,320 how little regret there was. 427 00:24:26,400 --> 00:24:28,720 - He became very conflicted about his feelings 428 00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:30,800 and his relationship with her. 429 00:24:30,880 --> 00:24:34,160 Because it had kind of slowly came to light 430 00:24:34,240 --> 00:24:37,520 that she was not just a mere, you know, 431 00:24:37,600 --> 00:24:39,400 oreja, you know, 432 00:24:39,480 --> 00:24:44,040 a lookout, that she was an assassin, that she killed people. 433 00:24:44,120 --> 00:24:45,320 - In Colombia people get killed all the time. 434 00:24:45,400 --> 00:24:47,760 In that town people were killed all the time, 435 00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:49,680 and she's doing a lot of the killing. 436 00:25:30,040 --> 00:25:32,080 - Now there were limits. 437 00:25:32,160 --> 00:25:34,680 She told me that she had a target that she was looking for 438 00:25:34,760 --> 00:25:36,200 that she was going to kill, 439 00:25:36,280 --> 00:25:38,120 and she asked me if I wanted to 440 00:25:38,200 --> 00:25:39,880 come along and photograph that. 441 00:25:40,760 --> 00:25:42,240 I chose not to do that. 442 00:25:42,320 --> 00:25:44,840 I felt that in some ways by me going along 443 00:25:44,920 --> 00:25:47,560 and photographing her killing someone, 444 00:25:47,640 --> 00:25:49,200 there would be two outcomes. 445 00:25:49,280 --> 00:25:52,000 One, it would feel as though I was actually condoning 446 00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:55,760 the murder by standing by and just photographing it 447 00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:58,880 and not stopping it from happening, and also, 448 00:25:58,960 --> 00:26:03,960 that was outside my personal envelope of acceptable risk, 449 00:26:05,080 --> 00:26:07,120 so I chose not to do that. 450 00:26:07,200 --> 00:26:11,520 And that's not a decision that I regret, I think, 451 00:26:11,600 --> 00:26:16,160 that that whole situation is hard enough to deal with 452 00:26:16,240 --> 00:26:18,120 retrospectively anyway, and if I had condoned in any way 453 00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:23,840 what she was doing more actively, 454 00:26:23,920 --> 00:26:28,280 then I would have more things to feel bad about, really. 455 00:26:30,400 --> 00:26:35,000 - I think that Jason was really high on the whole romance 456 00:26:35,080 --> 00:26:37,960 and danger and all that kind of thing of, like, 457 00:26:38,040 --> 00:26:39,120 dating this chick. 458 00:26:40,000 --> 00:26:44,120 Dating, yeah like they're going out to pizza and the movies. 459 00:26:44,200 --> 00:26:49,200 Having a little affair with this woman who's definitely 460 00:26:49,360 --> 00:26:53,160 knee deep in some pretty nefarious shit. 461 00:26:53,240 --> 00:26:54,520 I mean, 462 00:26:54,600 --> 00:26:56,920 that's attractive to everybody, 463 00:26:57,000 --> 00:26:58,960 that's why the story of Jason and Marylin 464 00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:02,080 has been so popular, everybody's like, ooh, ahh. 465 00:27:03,280 --> 00:27:06,120 It's so sexy, it's so dangerous, we love it. 466 00:27:07,160 --> 00:27:08,680 And Jason loved it for that. 467 00:27:08,760 --> 00:27:11,160 - One day she actually pointed the pistol at my face 468 00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:12,560 and said, why aren't you scared of me, 469 00:27:12,640 --> 00:27:14,920 aren't you scared that I will kill you? 470 00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:16,240 I said to her no, I'm not scared, 471 00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:18,000 I don't like being threatened, 472 00:27:18,080 --> 00:27:20,280 but if someone offers you money to kill me, 473 00:27:20,360 --> 00:27:21,920 let me know, and I'll pay you double 474 00:27:22,000 --> 00:27:23,320 to let me get to the airport. 475 00:27:23,400 --> 00:27:25,640 And that kind of lightened the situation, 476 00:27:25,720 --> 00:27:27,560 she laughed and put the gun down and, 477 00:27:28,760 --> 00:27:30,120 the moment passed. 478 00:27:31,640 --> 00:27:33,080 One evening Marylin came to the hotel 479 00:27:33,160 --> 00:27:37,360 that we were all staying in for dinner. 480 00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:38,840 - And our hotel happened to have this balcony 481 00:27:38,920 --> 00:27:41,280 right in the centre of town, it's a small town. 482 00:27:41,360 --> 00:27:44,960 - And just immediately, all the workers in the hotel, 483 00:27:45,040 --> 00:27:47,960 they're like. (dramatic music) 484 00:27:48,040 --> 00:27:49,400 - And our fixer was completely freaked out, 485 00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:51,000 he was like, I cannot be seen, like, 486 00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:52,760 I live here, I cannot be seen with her. 487 00:27:52,840 --> 00:27:54,120 This is gonna put my life in jeopardy, 488 00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:55,560 my family, everybody. 489 00:27:55,640 --> 00:27:57,560 - So our feeling was like, well, 490 00:27:57,640 --> 00:27:59,160 we'd just been compromised. 491 00:27:59,240 --> 00:28:00,400 We gotta get out of town. 492 00:28:00,480 --> 00:28:01,720 And Hector and I left. 493 00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:03,720 - And Jason did not come with us, yeah. 494 00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:08,360 (eerie music) 495 00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:12,480 (yelling) 496 00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:16,240 - Jason we had to throw him into somewhere immediately, 497 00:28:16,320 --> 00:28:17,840 make it his beat. 498 00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:20,800 And he had to learn really really quickly. 499 00:28:20,880 --> 00:28:24,080 It's one thing if they're wanting to do it, 500 00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:26,320 and actually having the talent, but, 501 00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:29,120 the being thrown into a place, 502 00:28:29,200 --> 00:28:31,600 the way you turn on the TV and everybody's, 503 00:28:31,680 --> 00:28:35,400 it looks like everybody's dying every moment of the day, 504 00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:37,480 it's kind of terrifying. 505 00:28:37,560 --> 00:28:40,040 (car horns) 506 00:28:40,120 --> 00:28:42,560 So we kicked him out the door and we equipped him, 507 00:28:42,640 --> 00:28:45,080 and it was like, go on, just, do it. 508 00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:47,680 - I arrived in a world, 509 00:28:47,760 --> 00:28:50,240 in a war totally different from Colombia. 510 00:28:50,320 --> 00:28:53,480 And one that I was really in no way prepared for. 511 00:28:54,640 --> 00:28:57,440 (emotional music) 512 00:29:08,840 --> 00:29:11,080 - I met Jason in Baghdad. 513 00:29:11,160 --> 00:29:14,960 He was a bit different to the other journalists in Baghdad, 514 00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:18,520 and he had not come from the same experiences. 515 00:29:18,600 --> 00:29:21,240 Which meant that he didn't really know how to carry himself 516 00:29:21,320 --> 00:29:22,960 in a place like Iraq. 517 00:29:23,040 --> 00:29:25,280 (helicopter propellers) 518 00:29:25,360 --> 00:29:26,440 - Hey Joe? - Yes, sir? 519 00:29:26,520 --> 00:29:27,800 - [Man] Take that rug off. 520 00:29:30,320 --> 00:29:34,200 - Freaking Jason ended up in the spider hole 521 00:29:34,280 --> 00:29:37,240 on his first assignment, and he calling us, 522 00:29:37,320 --> 00:29:40,400 and he didn't even know what to fucking do, 523 00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:43,000 you know, he was like, holy shit, I'm an idiot. 524 00:29:43,080 --> 00:29:46,440 - [Jason] My mind wasn't in sort of news gathering mode yet, 525 00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:48,160 that wasn't the photographer I was, 526 00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:49,400 I wasn't a news photographer. 527 00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:52,040 They're seeing this crowd of people around this hole, 528 00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:53,880 just bang bang bang bang bang bang bang, 529 00:29:53,960 --> 00:29:55,560 shooting so many pictures and just, 530 00:29:55,640 --> 00:29:58,400 looking like, it's a hole in the ground. 531 00:29:58,480 --> 00:29:59,320 - It's really a black hole, okay? 532 00:30:00,640 --> 00:30:01,760 - Okay. - Okay. 533 00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:02,720 - I was just wondering like, 534 00:30:02,800 --> 00:30:04,920 how many different angles can you shoot 535 00:30:05,000 --> 00:30:07,640 a hole in the ground from and make it interesting? 536 00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:09,760 But then of course later on when I saw the work 537 00:30:09,840 --> 00:30:10,840 from the other photographers I realised that 538 00:30:10,920 --> 00:30:13,560 there were quite a few angles that they had done it from 539 00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:15,720 that I hadn't. 540 00:30:15,800 --> 00:30:17,320 It's amazing, you have to have your head in the right place 541 00:30:17,400 --> 00:30:19,160 and you have to know what you're doing 542 00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:20,720 and maximise the situation. 543 00:30:20,800 --> 00:30:24,720 And this was so early on in that whole learning process 544 00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:27,080 that whilst I got pictures published 545 00:30:27,160 --> 00:30:29,520 and I was paid for them, 546 00:30:29,600 --> 00:30:32,600 I didn't do a particularly thorough job on that occasion. 547 00:30:32,680 --> 00:30:35,000 - It was very clear that whatever he'd been doing before, 548 00:30:35,080 --> 00:30:37,880 he hadn't really been working for someone. 549 00:30:37,960 --> 00:30:41,280 And he hadn't worked in a conservative environment like that 550 00:30:41,360 --> 00:30:43,040 so I mean, he would just say wildly inappropriate things 551 00:30:43,120 --> 00:30:45,080 and do wildly inappropriate things. 552 00:30:45,160 --> 00:30:48,800 He would show pictures to our Iraqi drivers 553 00:30:48,880 --> 00:30:50,920 of naked Colombian women, 554 00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:53,880 and people snorting coke off them and things like that and, 555 00:30:53,960 --> 00:30:57,760 and I just eventually took him aside and said, 556 00:30:57,840 --> 00:30:59,440 you know, sweetheart, 557 00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:02,200 this is Iraq, it's not Colombia. 558 00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:11,760 (yelling in foreign language) 559 00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:15,440 - Pretty much one of the craziest moments 560 00:31:15,520 --> 00:31:17,160 of the time spent in Iraq, 561 00:31:17,240 --> 00:31:19,720 I was in the towns of Najaf and Kufa, 562 00:31:19,800 --> 00:31:23,040 which were Muqtada al-Sadr's territory. 563 00:31:23,120 --> 00:31:25,600 He was leading a group called the Mahdi Army. 564 00:31:27,960 --> 00:31:30,400 The Mahdi Army were fighting the Americans 565 00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:33,240 on the edge of town, they were hyped up, 566 00:31:33,320 --> 00:31:34,240 they're waving their weapons, 567 00:31:34,320 --> 00:31:35,640 they're firing their guns in the air. 568 00:31:35,720 --> 00:31:37,880 And some of them are saying, you can't take pictures, 569 00:31:37,960 --> 00:31:39,080 no pictures, no pictures. 570 00:31:39,160 --> 00:31:41,240 Then another one will stand in front of you 571 00:31:41,320 --> 00:31:42,280 and ask you to take a picture 572 00:31:42,360 --> 00:31:43,360 and then someone else would come and hit you 573 00:31:43,440 --> 00:31:46,320 with the butt of their Kalashnikov and push you out the way. 574 00:31:46,400 --> 00:31:49,520 And at one moment I had four Mahdi Army fighters 575 00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:52,280 with Kalashnikovs pointed at my chest saying, 576 00:31:52,360 --> 00:31:53,360 are you British? 577 00:31:54,880 --> 00:31:56,800 Knowing if I said I was British, 578 00:31:56,880 --> 00:31:58,880 they would pull the trigger and that's that. 579 00:31:58,960 --> 00:32:00,640 Are you American, nope, nope. 580 00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:01,480 Where are you from, 581 00:32:01,560 --> 00:32:03,760 so I said the first thing that came into my head 582 00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:06,080 that seemed like a safe answer was that I was Irish. 583 00:32:06,160 --> 00:32:08,800 And they're like, ah, Gerry Adams, very good man. 584 00:32:10,320 --> 00:32:12,240 A moment later, surrounded by another group, 585 00:32:12,320 --> 00:32:14,160 and this time the guy has a hand grenade, 586 00:32:14,240 --> 00:32:16,720 he holds a grenade in my face with his finger in the ring, 587 00:32:16,800 --> 00:32:18,400 and he starts the same questioning process. 588 00:32:18,480 --> 00:32:19,880 They're all hyped up on adrenaline, 589 00:32:19,960 --> 00:32:21,040 you're hyped up on adrenaline, 590 00:32:21,120 --> 00:32:23,120 your heart is banging backwards and forwards 591 00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:24,680 off the plate in your body armour. 592 00:32:24,760 --> 00:32:27,880 They're quite happy to blow you up and all go to heaven 593 00:32:27,960 --> 00:32:29,360 or wherever it is they think they're going, 594 00:32:29,440 --> 00:32:32,360 and you have to kind of out-crazy the crazies. 595 00:32:32,440 --> 00:32:34,080 So you sort of throw your hands up in the air and say 596 00:32:34,160 --> 00:32:35,920 look, you know, I just told these guys all of this. 597 00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:38,240 And they can't understand a word that you're saying, 598 00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:40,320 but your attitude and your body language 599 00:32:40,400 --> 00:32:43,240 somehow conveys something and they, 600 00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:46,000 for some reason, they backed off. 601 00:32:46,080 --> 00:32:48,760 (ominous music) 602 00:33:12,920 --> 00:33:15,320 - He really got it and he really enjoyed it, 603 00:33:15,400 --> 00:33:17,280 he enjoyed the moment. 604 00:33:17,360 --> 00:33:20,560 Because it is about living the life, 605 00:33:20,640 --> 00:33:22,720 and it's about being in the moment 606 00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:24,360 and being party of history. 607 00:33:25,320 --> 00:33:29,160 - When I was in Iraq I received an email from Marylin 608 00:33:29,240 --> 00:33:31,640 saying that she felt that I was the only person 609 00:33:31,720 --> 00:33:33,680 who could help her and that she did want to 610 00:33:33,760 --> 00:33:35,600 get out of the situation that she was in, 611 00:33:35,680 --> 00:33:37,960 but the paramilitaries, they don't allow people to leave, 612 00:33:38,040 --> 00:33:39,200 because quite literally, 613 00:33:39,280 --> 00:33:40,880 they know where the bodies are buried. 614 00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:42,040 So someone like Marylin 615 00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:45,280 would be privy to a lot of information, 616 00:33:45,360 --> 00:33:47,440 and so her group were not really gonna 617 00:33:47,520 --> 00:33:49,200 just let her walk away. 618 00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:53,120 I don't recall exactly how I responded to her email but, 619 00:33:54,480 --> 00:33:56,640 it wasn't in a particularly sympathetic manner, 620 00:33:56,720 --> 00:34:00,640 and certainly I didn't come up with a solution 621 00:34:00,720 --> 00:34:02,960 as to how to help her get out of her problem. 622 00:34:04,560 --> 00:34:07,520 And that is a decision 623 00:34:07,600 --> 00:34:10,200 that would possibly come back to haunt me, 624 00:34:11,680 --> 00:34:12,520 later. 625 00:34:14,080 --> 00:34:17,120 (explosion) 626 00:34:17,200 --> 00:34:20,320 Pretty much every day there would be suicide bombs. 627 00:34:20,400 --> 00:34:22,200 They were around about eight o'clock in the morning 628 00:34:22,280 --> 00:34:23,840 and about five o'clock in the evening. 629 00:34:23,920 --> 00:34:26,840 So those times became nicknamed bomb o'clock. 630 00:34:32,160 --> 00:34:34,360 (explosion) 631 00:34:34,480 --> 00:34:37,000 On the 18th of November, 2005, 632 00:34:37,080 --> 00:34:39,040 I was woken up by a huge explosion 633 00:34:39,120 --> 00:34:42,520 which blew the glass windows into my room. 634 00:34:42,600 --> 00:34:44,480 I had no idea what it was, I had been sound asleep, 635 00:34:44,560 --> 00:34:46,960 I woke up just to feel this freezing air 636 00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:50,000 and to see that the window had been blown in. 637 00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:53,720 And I lay there kind of semi sort of frozen in shock 638 00:34:53,800 --> 00:34:58,000 on the bed, trying to sort of reboot my brain, 639 00:34:58,080 --> 00:35:00,400 work out what had happened, and then there was another, 640 00:35:00,480 --> 00:35:02,040 much, much bigger explosion 641 00:35:02,120 --> 00:35:03,800 which ripped the aluminium window frames 642 00:35:03,880 --> 00:35:06,680 away from the concrete, threw those across the room. 643 00:35:06,760 --> 00:35:10,560 The door was blown off its hinges, the ceiling collapsed. 644 00:35:10,640 --> 00:35:13,480 Pull on my jeans and boots, put on the body armour, 645 00:35:13,560 --> 00:35:15,480 grab my money and passport 646 00:35:15,560 --> 00:35:17,800 in case the insurgents were climbing over the wall 647 00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:20,840 or we needed to climb over the other wall and escape. 648 00:35:20,920 --> 00:35:24,000 And then get outside and start taking pictures. 649 00:35:24,080 --> 00:35:26,760 But as I walked around the room, 650 00:35:26,840 --> 00:35:29,360 really plucking up the courage 651 00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:33,240 to go and put myself out into this inferno 652 00:35:33,320 --> 00:35:35,480 that was kind of raging outside, 653 00:35:35,560 --> 00:35:37,200 there was some sort of strange hesitation, 654 00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:38,720 I was trying to find little distractions 655 00:35:38,800 --> 00:35:41,640 to kind of delay that moment of truth. 656 00:35:41,720 --> 00:35:43,720 And I remember opening the fridge 657 00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:46,960 to see whether my eggs had broken in the explosion, 658 00:35:47,040 --> 00:35:49,480 and being bizarrely delighted 659 00:35:49,560 --> 00:35:51,480 that they were all still in one piece. 660 00:35:52,600 --> 00:35:54,800 Outside I could see burning cars, 661 00:35:54,880 --> 00:35:57,480 smoke billowing everywhere, people screaming, 662 00:35:57,560 --> 00:35:59,280 people running around shooting. 663 00:36:00,200 --> 00:36:03,200 The windows of every building for, you know, 664 00:36:03,280 --> 00:36:06,000 a block in either direction had been destroyed. 665 00:36:06,080 --> 00:36:08,080 There were dozens of cars on fire 666 00:36:08,160 --> 00:36:10,280 where shrapnel had ripped into their fuel tanks 667 00:36:10,360 --> 00:36:11,920 and exploded those. 668 00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:13,000 And just all of these people 669 00:36:13,080 --> 00:36:15,240 sort of wandering around in shock. 670 00:36:15,320 --> 00:36:18,000 Their crime, 671 00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:21,440 the reason that their lives had just been turned upside down 672 00:36:21,520 --> 00:36:23,920 or destroyed was that they just happened to live 673 00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:27,840 next to a hotel full of foreign journalists and contractors, 674 00:36:27,920 --> 00:36:30,200 and that's who the insurgents wanted to kill. 675 00:36:31,360 --> 00:36:34,160 And in my rush to get out there and take pictures, 676 00:36:34,240 --> 00:36:36,840 I decided to jump, 677 00:36:36,920 --> 00:36:40,600 or let myself drop from the first floor balcony. 678 00:36:40,680 --> 00:36:44,240 And so having survived these two massive explosions 679 00:36:44,320 --> 00:36:47,640 which were later reported as being a 400 pound car bomb 680 00:36:47,720 --> 00:36:50,040 and then a one thousand pound truck bomb, 681 00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:52,400 my injuries were sustained by dropping 682 00:36:52,480 --> 00:36:54,120 from the first floor balcony into the rubble 683 00:36:54,200 --> 00:36:56,680 and twisting both ankles and scraping my arm. 684 00:36:58,440 --> 00:37:00,120 What was quite a strange experience 685 00:37:00,200 --> 00:37:02,320 was watching the press corps 686 00:37:02,400 --> 00:37:04,040 who were living in other parts of the city 687 00:37:04,120 --> 00:37:06,680 arrive and start photographing this scene. 688 00:37:06,760 --> 00:37:09,680 And suddenly it gave you a little insight 689 00:37:09,760 --> 00:37:11,560 into how it is when you arrive at a scene 690 00:37:11,640 --> 00:37:13,640 and someone's wandering around slightly dazed 691 00:37:13,720 --> 00:37:17,240 after a bomb attack on their house or something like that. 692 00:37:17,320 --> 00:37:20,600 And a car pulls up and four people jump out and just, 693 00:37:20,680 --> 00:37:23,560 they don't talk to them, they don't communicate with them, 694 00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:25,120 they just run towards them and point the camera 695 00:37:25,200 --> 00:37:27,000 in their face and start taking pictures. 696 00:37:27,080 --> 00:37:29,200 It felt very strange, it was a, 697 00:37:30,600 --> 00:37:34,720 a combination of feeling like the victim, 698 00:37:34,800 --> 00:37:38,320 that this was my story, except that of course, 699 00:37:39,320 --> 00:37:41,520 when it happened I'd immediately gone outside 700 00:37:41,640 --> 00:37:42,960 and starting shooting pictures as well. 701 00:37:43,080 --> 00:37:44,920 It was a very confusing incident, 702 00:37:45,040 --> 00:37:47,360 and the feeling of surviving it, 703 00:37:47,440 --> 00:37:49,480 the euphoria, is just incredible. 704 00:37:49,560 --> 00:37:51,240 I got told off by one of my colleagues 705 00:37:51,320 --> 00:37:53,120 because you have to stop smiling, 706 00:37:53,200 --> 00:37:55,760 you're just walking around with this big grin on your face, 707 00:37:55,840 --> 00:37:58,200 and people have died, 15 people were killed, 708 00:37:58,280 --> 00:37:59,120 40 were wounded. 709 00:37:59,200 --> 00:38:01,160 And of course I wasn't doing it deliberately, 710 00:38:01,240 --> 00:38:02,680 it was just that, 711 00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:06,320 I was so happy to be alive and to have survived this. 712 00:38:09,240 --> 00:38:11,400 One of the weirdest things ever to have 713 00:38:11,480 --> 00:38:13,960 come out of covering suicide bombings 714 00:38:14,040 --> 00:38:17,240 was the fact that you would nearly always find 715 00:38:17,320 --> 00:38:20,600 the male suicide bomber's genitalia on the ground. 716 00:38:20,680 --> 00:38:24,960 And apparently one of their preparations 717 00:38:25,040 --> 00:38:26,200 for going and blowing themselves up 718 00:38:26,280 --> 00:38:28,600 would be to pack their genitals in silver foil 719 00:38:28,680 --> 00:38:29,880 so that it would be intact, 720 00:38:29,960 --> 00:38:33,600 ready for going to heaven and the 72 virgins. 721 00:38:35,480 --> 00:38:38,160 (muffled radio) 722 00:38:39,280 --> 00:38:41,600 (explosion) 723 00:38:42,560 --> 00:38:44,760 The far south of the country, Basra, 724 00:38:44,840 --> 00:38:47,280 down towards the Kuwait border 725 00:38:47,360 --> 00:38:50,040 was an area controlled by British forces. 726 00:38:50,120 --> 00:38:54,400 And a small contingent of them also were based in Baghdad. 727 00:38:54,480 --> 00:38:56,160 And the soldiers that I first met there 728 00:38:56,240 --> 00:38:58,360 were the Royal Irish Regiment, 729 00:38:58,440 --> 00:39:01,320 and they were protecting the road called Route Irish. 730 00:39:01,400 --> 00:39:02,880 Which was for a long time 731 00:39:02,960 --> 00:39:04,600 labelled the most dangerous road in the world. 732 00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:07,960 It's the road that ran from Baghdad Airport 733 00:39:08,040 --> 00:39:09,280 into central Baghdad. 734 00:39:09,360 --> 00:39:12,760 It was a road that normal cars would probably take 735 00:39:12,840 --> 00:39:16,920 30, 40 minutes to drive along at normal speed. 736 00:39:17,000 --> 00:39:20,000 The soldiers could do it in, something, 737 00:39:20,080 --> 00:39:22,880 I seem to remember something like about 10 minutes. 738 00:39:22,960 --> 00:39:25,760 It wasn't safe for them to drive any slower, or to stop. 739 00:39:26,800 --> 00:39:29,200 The soldiers on top cover above 740 00:39:29,280 --> 00:39:31,760 would be training their weapon on any flyovers 741 00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:34,080 to make sure people weren't dropping grenades off. 742 00:39:34,160 --> 00:39:36,120 Any vehicles that didn't get out of the way, 743 00:39:36,200 --> 00:39:39,040 the first technique was to throw a water bottle, 744 00:39:39,120 --> 00:39:41,680 so it slammed into the hood of the car 745 00:39:41,760 --> 00:39:43,080 and gave the driver a bit of a shock. 746 00:39:43,160 --> 00:39:44,360 'Cause he maybe he just hadn't seen you 747 00:39:44,440 --> 00:39:45,560 or something like that. 748 00:39:53,600 --> 00:39:55,400 Another thing with being able to spend quite a bit of time 749 00:39:55,480 --> 00:39:57,000 with the soldiers that you then get to cover 750 00:39:57,080 --> 00:39:59,400 all sorts of little parts of their lives. 751 00:40:00,440 --> 00:40:02,320 It was quite interesting that a lot of the soldiers 752 00:40:02,400 --> 00:40:04,200 obviously cover the walls in pornography. 753 00:40:04,280 --> 00:40:05,400 Naked women is something 754 00:40:05,480 --> 00:40:07,120 that helps to get them through the tour. 755 00:40:07,200 --> 00:40:09,680 But you also saw young guys who had got their girlfriends 756 00:40:09,760 --> 00:40:13,160 or wives pregnant on the last visit home, 757 00:40:13,240 --> 00:40:16,520 and the pictures that they had on the wall were of the scan, 758 00:40:16,600 --> 00:40:19,280 or maybe they had a newborn baby and they had those pictures 759 00:40:19,360 --> 00:40:20,680 and they'd go to sleep every night 760 00:40:20,760 --> 00:40:23,160 looking at the pictures of their newborn child. 761 00:40:27,920 --> 00:40:29,360 There is a cemetery in Baghdad 762 00:40:29,440 --> 00:40:31,840 which is just for burying babies, 763 00:40:31,920 --> 00:40:33,920 there were no adults buried there at all. 764 00:40:34,000 --> 00:40:37,600 The situation during the war was that there's so much, 765 00:40:38,840 --> 00:40:41,680 so much stress being put on the civilian population, 766 00:40:41,760 --> 00:40:43,400 there's the suicide bombs, 767 00:40:43,480 --> 00:40:45,480 there's kidnappings, assassinations. 768 00:40:46,520 --> 00:40:51,520 Lots of women were losing their children during birth. 769 00:40:51,680 --> 00:40:55,320 And another issue was that, to counteract the stress, 770 00:40:55,400 --> 00:40:57,200 a lot of women were taking drugs 771 00:40:57,280 --> 00:40:59,880 like Valium and diazepam and this kind of thing, 772 00:40:59,960 --> 00:41:00,920 so there are also a lot of children 773 00:41:01,000 --> 00:41:03,280 being born with deformities. 774 00:41:03,360 --> 00:41:06,400 So this was a very strange place to work, 775 00:41:06,480 --> 00:41:10,560 to go to the cemetery, meet the cemetery workers, 776 00:41:10,640 --> 00:41:13,000 and then basically wait for a family, 777 00:41:13,080 --> 00:41:15,280 which it would happen every day several times a day, 778 00:41:15,360 --> 00:41:17,960 normally the husband or perhaps a brother, 779 00:41:18,040 --> 00:41:19,160 or someone like that, 780 00:41:19,240 --> 00:41:23,560 would bring a tiny corpse wrapped in white cloth. 781 00:41:23,640 --> 00:41:25,280 The funeral workers would prepare the body 782 00:41:25,360 --> 00:41:27,080 and bury it in a small grave. 783 00:41:28,040 --> 00:41:29,560 It would be interesting in some ways 784 00:41:29,640 --> 00:41:32,560 to go back to that cemetery and that would be, 785 00:41:33,560 --> 00:41:37,000 an evidence of some of the impact 786 00:41:37,080 --> 00:41:39,960 on the Iraqis of that, of that, 787 00:41:41,440 --> 00:41:45,000 of that conflict, of that invasion and occupation. 788 00:41:45,080 --> 00:41:48,760 - Carnage you can get somewhat accustomed to. 789 00:41:48,840 --> 00:41:51,280 Suffering is more difficult, so, 790 00:41:51,360 --> 00:41:53,800 if you see people suffering because they've been bereaved 791 00:41:53,880 --> 00:41:56,200 by the carnage you've seen, that's very difficult. 792 00:41:56,280 --> 00:41:57,400 Seeing children who've been killed 793 00:41:57,480 --> 00:41:58,960 is the one thing that gets everyone, 794 00:41:59,040 --> 00:42:00,800 because I think that you have some, 795 00:42:01,760 --> 00:42:05,160 there's some very very visceral human response 796 00:42:05,240 --> 00:42:07,560 that is, somehow I'm meant to protect children, 797 00:42:07,640 --> 00:42:08,720 we are meant to protect children. 798 00:42:08,800 --> 00:42:10,080 So seeing them harmed in any way 799 00:42:10,160 --> 00:42:13,960 I think is absolutely soul-polluting. 800 00:42:14,040 --> 00:42:15,880 I used to tell Jason he needed, 801 00:42:15,960 --> 00:42:18,480 it didn't matter what he got, he needed to get out more. 802 00:42:18,560 --> 00:42:19,960 'Cause as a freelancer he would go in 803 00:42:20,040 --> 00:42:21,960 and he would stay much, much longer. 804 00:42:22,040 --> 00:42:23,840 Staff correspondents would rotate in and out. 805 00:42:23,920 --> 00:42:25,760 You would do sort of six or eight weeks. 806 00:42:25,840 --> 00:42:27,920 But he was staying for months at a time. 807 00:42:28,000 --> 00:42:29,000 I said no you need to get out 808 00:42:29,080 --> 00:42:30,840 and just give your brain a break from this, 809 00:42:30,920 --> 00:42:33,400 you cannot sit there day after day 810 00:42:33,480 --> 00:42:37,200 with that threat hovering over you that way that it did. 811 00:42:38,240 --> 00:42:41,240 - I was taking a break from Iraq 812 00:42:41,320 --> 00:42:44,400 where I had been almost solidly for six months, 813 00:42:44,480 --> 00:42:47,440 and that I wanted to travel back down to Colombia 814 00:42:47,520 --> 00:42:49,960 and see if I could find out what happened to Marylin. 815 00:42:50,040 --> 00:42:52,480 So I flew back down to Puerto Asis. 816 00:42:52,560 --> 00:42:54,240 I checked into the same hotel 817 00:42:54,320 --> 00:42:57,080 that Marylin and I had spend our first night together, 818 00:42:57,160 --> 00:43:00,120 and I stood in the bathroom looking in the mirror and 819 00:43:01,440 --> 00:43:03,680 started thinking about the reality 820 00:43:03,760 --> 00:43:06,720 of what I was now going to face. 821 00:43:06,800 --> 00:43:07,800 Thinking well, there's two things, 822 00:43:07,880 --> 00:43:09,480 either I'm gonna arrive at that house 823 00:43:09,560 --> 00:43:11,800 and as I have done in the past, 824 00:43:11,880 --> 00:43:13,400 her daughter will come running out 825 00:43:13,480 --> 00:43:16,760 and leap onto my back and want to have a shoulder ride, 826 00:43:16,840 --> 00:43:18,960 and Marylin will come out and smile, 827 00:43:19,040 --> 00:43:22,640 and she will tell me about what's going on here in Putumayo. 828 00:43:22,720 --> 00:43:26,080 And I will tell her about life in Iraq. 829 00:43:26,160 --> 00:43:29,640 And things will be basically exactly the same 830 00:43:29,720 --> 00:43:31,320 as the last time I was here. 831 00:43:34,840 --> 00:43:37,080 When I got there, her father came out, 832 00:43:37,160 --> 00:43:40,360 and he was very surprised to see me. 833 00:43:40,440 --> 00:43:44,080 And his eyes kind of started to fill with tears 834 00:43:44,160 --> 00:43:45,760 a little bit and he said, 835 00:43:45,840 --> 00:43:48,520 I guess you know what happened to the girl. 836 00:43:48,600 --> 00:43:51,080 And he told me that she had died, 837 00:43:51,160 --> 00:43:52,720 he didn't actually say that she had been killed, 838 00:43:52,800 --> 00:43:55,560 he said that she died, it happened six months before, 839 00:43:55,640 --> 00:43:58,440 and that she was buried in the local cemetery. 840 00:43:58,560 --> 00:44:02,120 And so I asked if I could go with her daughter 841 00:44:02,200 --> 00:44:05,080 and her mother the next day 842 00:44:05,160 --> 00:44:07,360 to put some flowers on the grave. 843 00:44:11,600 --> 00:44:14,400 I did feel really sorry for her daughter who, 844 00:44:14,480 --> 00:44:17,280 in reality, is the real victim in all of this, 845 00:44:17,360 --> 00:44:19,720 her mother made choices to do things 846 00:44:19,800 --> 00:44:22,600 and died as a consequence of her choices. 847 00:44:22,680 --> 00:44:25,640 Whereas her daughter is completely blameless 848 00:44:25,720 --> 00:44:26,880 in the whole situation. 849 00:44:29,080 --> 00:44:31,920 The reason that it was explained to me 850 00:44:32,000 --> 00:44:33,360 that Marylin had been killed 851 00:44:33,440 --> 00:44:36,920 was because she had been accused of being an informer, 852 00:44:37,000 --> 00:44:40,000 and the paramilitaries had stoned her to death, 853 00:44:40,080 --> 00:44:41,920 they had crushed her head with rocks. 854 00:44:43,720 --> 00:44:46,360 And then they had shot her. 855 00:44:46,440 --> 00:44:50,320 And the reason for killing her in this manner was that, 856 00:44:52,440 --> 00:44:56,720 in Colombian Spanish, the word for informer is sapo, 857 00:44:56,800 --> 00:44:57,720 as in frog. 858 00:44:57,800 --> 00:45:01,520 And the way to kill a frog is to stone it to death, 859 00:45:01,600 --> 00:45:02,320 to throw rocks at it. 860 00:45:02,400 --> 00:45:03,880 And so they had killed her 861 00:45:03,960 --> 00:45:06,000 in this kind of ritualistic manner 862 00:45:06,080 --> 00:45:08,720 as a warning to other potential informers. 863 00:45:11,320 --> 00:45:14,520 Marylin's story became really the thread 864 00:45:14,600 --> 00:45:18,200 to my Colombia project, it gave it some, 865 00:45:18,280 --> 00:45:20,120 some theme and some purpose. 866 00:45:20,200 --> 00:45:23,120 Instead of just being a lot of random images 867 00:45:23,200 --> 00:45:26,600 from different sides of the conflict, 868 00:45:26,680 --> 00:45:29,280 she really defined the conflict for me. 869 00:45:29,360 --> 00:45:31,240 Very much like Colombia itself, 870 00:45:31,320 --> 00:45:34,280 a place of beauty with lots of resources, 871 00:45:34,360 --> 00:45:37,600 that is just trapped in a cycle 872 00:45:37,680 --> 00:45:39,920 of self-destruction, basically. 873 00:45:48,680 --> 00:45:51,000 (footsteps) 874 00:45:55,040 --> 00:45:56,680 - I've spoken to Jason quite a bit 875 00:45:56,760 --> 00:45:59,520 about his imbed in Afghanistan when the British soldier 876 00:46:00,440 --> 00:46:03,200 was injured with the IED. 877 00:46:16,200 --> 00:46:17,880 - [Friend] Primarily it first started out 878 00:46:17,960 --> 00:46:20,520 as an ethical conversation about, 879 00:46:20,600 --> 00:46:22,360 jeez, I don't know what to do with these pictures, 880 00:46:22,440 --> 00:46:24,320 they're really important, but, you know, 881 00:46:24,400 --> 00:46:28,160 I've gotta clear it with the kid's family, 882 00:46:28,240 --> 00:46:30,720 I gotta really think hard about this. 883 00:46:30,800 --> 00:46:33,280 And I was really pleased by that whole conversation 884 00:46:33,360 --> 00:46:34,960 because I'll tell you right now, 885 00:46:35,040 --> 00:46:36,960 majority of the photographers out there, 886 00:46:37,040 --> 00:46:38,240 they'd just like, I don't know, 887 00:46:38,320 --> 00:46:40,520 it's all about me, me and my pictures. 888 00:46:40,600 --> 00:46:42,720 They'll say it's about the importance of the whole story, 889 00:46:42,800 --> 00:46:46,040 but it's really about them. 890 00:46:54,080 --> 00:46:56,360 - And that was definitely a sign of maturity in Jason. 891 00:46:56,440 --> 00:46:58,400 In the past I think that he would, 892 00:46:58,480 --> 00:47:00,000 he would've made that same argument about, 893 00:47:00,080 --> 00:47:02,360 you know, it's for the greater good. 894 00:47:02,440 --> 00:47:05,160 Which I just find kind of absurd. 895 00:47:05,240 --> 00:47:06,960 I understand it a little bit, but, 896 00:47:07,920 --> 00:47:10,600 ego trumps that shit almost every time. 897 00:47:19,400 --> 00:47:22,240 - I received an email from the MoD 898 00:47:23,600 --> 00:47:27,560 saying that Steve's recovery is going very well, 899 00:47:27,640 --> 00:47:28,720 and we are at a stage 900 00:47:28,800 --> 00:47:31,840 where we might be able to move forward with this. 901 00:47:31,920 --> 00:47:34,160 So we arrived Headley Court, 902 00:47:34,240 --> 00:47:37,680 and were met by a sort of MoD representative, 903 00:47:37,760 --> 00:47:39,320 and we went in to see Stephen. 904 00:47:39,400 --> 00:47:41,360 Absolutely amazing experience, 905 00:47:41,440 --> 00:47:44,560 I hadn't seen him for basically five months. 906 00:47:44,640 --> 00:47:47,520 Here he was wheeling himself around in a wheelchair, 907 00:47:47,600 --> 00:47:50,560 he was smiling, he was happy, he looked well. 908 00:47:50,640 --> 00:47:51,920 I showed Stephen all of the pictures, 909 00:47:52,000 --> 00:47:53,680 we looked through them, and he was fascinated, 910 00:47:53,760 --> 00:47:56,520 he was fascinated to see the damage to his legs, 911 00:47:56,600 --> 00:47:57,840 and he was pointing at this, and he's, 912 00:47:57,920 --> 00:47:58,680 ah, yeah, I remember that. 913 00:47:58,760 --> 00:48:02,760 He did remember getting dropped on the stretcher twice. 914 00:48:02,840 --> 00:48:05,000 He was basically conscious all the way 915 00:48:05,080 --> 00:48:07,560 from the blast happening until the helicopter. 916 00:48:07,640 --> 00:48:11,000 (helicopter propellers) 917 00:48:12,440 --> 00:48:13,440 The first thing I asked him is 918 00:48:13,520 --> 00:48:15,680 whether he had any thoughts or concerns 919 00:48:15,760 --> 00:48:17,640 about the whole process that we were going through, 920 00:48:17,720 --> 00:48:20,120 about these images, about what I might do with them, 921 00:48:20,200 --> 00:48:23,800 whether he had concerns about the article I might write. 922 00:48:23,880 --> 00:48:26,360 So he basically said that he had no concerns, 923 00:48:26,440 --> 00:48:29,120 he felt that he was gonna be happy for them to be published, 924 00:48:29,200 --> 00:48:32,080 he liked the idea of the story be told and so on. 925 00:48:32,160 --> 00:48:34,960 My whole spirit, everything, were lifted. 926 00:48:35,040 --> 00:48:37,520 All this nervousness that I'd had about 927 00:48:37,600 --> 00:48:39,080 whether he would approve them or not, 928 00:48:39,160 --> 00:48:40,960 obviously all completely evaporated. 929 00:48:42,680 --> 00:48:45,360 - I think that Jason makes an incredible point 930 00:48:45,440 --> 00:48:48,480 in going back and seeing the guy who's lost both his legs, 931 00:48:48,560 --> 00:48:50,520 and he's okay with it. 932 00:48:50,600 --> 00:48:51,760 That says the whole thing, 933 00:48:51,840 --> 00:48:54,600 because it actually says something about walking wounded. 934 00:48:54,680 --> 00:48:57,400 It says something about the tenacity of mankind. 935 00:48:58,480 --> 00:49:02,520 - One of the most poignant moments 936 00:49:02,600 --> 00:49:07,600 during that day in Helmand was when the helicopter took off 937 00:49:08,120 --> 00:49:10,480 carrying Stephen to the hospital, 938 00:49:10,560 --> 00:49:13,360 and we got into a safe compound. 939 00:49:13,440 --> 00:49:16,000 And the soldiers came over and were shaking my hand 940 00:49:16,080 --> 00:49:20,560 and thanking me for helping to carry the stretcher. 941 00:49:20,640 --> 00:49:24,400 And one of them said that he never thought 942 00:49:24,480 --> 00:49:25,560 he'd see a journalist do that, 943 00:49:25,640 --> 00:49:27,520 and I thought it was so, so sad 944 00:49:27,600 --> 00:49:31,480 that this is the impression that these men have 945 00:49:31,560 --> 00:49:35,560 of journalists and the media, that they're only there 946 00:49:35,640 --> 00:49:38,800 to take something away and not to contribute something. 947 00:49:38,880 --> 00:49:41,720 That they're kind of a bit like a pack of vultures 948 00:49:41,800 --> 00:49:44,920 waiting for something unfortunate to happen. 949 00:49:45,000 --> 00:49:47,320 And that, I felt quite proud, really. 950 00:49:54,640 --> 00:49:57,560 (screaming) 951 00:49:57,640 --> 00:50:01,440 (yelling in foreign language) 952 00:50:05,680 --> 00:50:08,000 (screaming) 953 00:50:11,360 --> 00:50:14,200 Conflict is very often a lot of ordinary people 954 00:50:14,280 --> 00:50:16,800 put into very extraordinary situations. 955 00:50:18,400 --> 00:50:23,040 In the summer of 2006 the war in Lebanon broke out. 956 00:50:47,480 --> 00:50:51,320 (yelling in foreign language) 957 00:51:04,000 --> 00:51:06,560 - There were hundreds of photographers and journalists. 958 00:51:06,640 --> 00:51:09,520 So I arrived at one place and you could see five or six 959 00:51:09,600 --> 00:51:13,480 TV crews all with a TV anchor doing a live broadcast. 960 00:51:13,560 --> 00:51:17,880 - It attracted an awful lot of very green freelancers 961 00:51:17,960 --> 00:51:20,320 who really didn't know how to conduct themselves. 962 00:51:20,400 --> 00:51:23,800 - More and more young people are going out to do this job, 963 00:51:23,880 --> 00:51:27,880 and they're being encouraged by the journalism schools. 964 00:51:27,960 --> 00:51:29,640 And there's no job! 965 00:51:29,720 --> 00:51:31,400 There's no job. 966 00:51:31,480 --> 00:51:32,520 So... 967 00:51:34,280 --> 00:51:38,600 It's gonna push all the young photographers 968 00:51:38,680 --> 00:51:42,840 beyond the pale of acceptable conduct. 969 00:51:42,920 --> 00:51:44,120 - Some of these things do actually 970 00:51:44,200 --> 00:51:46,440 turn into a big fricking circus. 971 00:51:46,520 --> 00:51:48,600 - There would be five or six carloads of journalists 972 00:51:48,680 --> 00:51:50,600 screeching through the streets, and others running, 973 00:51:50,680 --> 00:51:52,800 and an ambulance would stop and there would be perhaps 974 00:51:52,880 --> 00:51:54,920 20 photographers crowding around the back door 975 00:51:55,000 --> 00:51:57,800 and you saw local Red Cross ambulance drivers 976 00:51:57,880 --> 00:52:00,040 pleading with the photographers to move back 977 00:52:00,120 --> 00:52:01,360 because they weren't giving them enough space 978 00:52:01,440 --> 00:52:03,880 to get their injured person out of the ambulance. 979 00:52:05,000 --> 00:52:07,240 - I've come this close to just beating people 980 00:52:07,320 --> 00:52:10,320 within an inch of their life for just being so, 981 00:52:10,400 --> 00:52:14,200 either rude to me, or rude to the subject matter. 982 00:52:14,280 --> 00:52:15,760 Like, Jesus Christ, man. 983 00:52:16,760 --> 00:52:17,720 Step back. 984 00:52:18,560 --> 00:52:21,000 Give these people some room, you know? 985 00:52:35,840 --> 00:52:39,720 - And woe betide you if you weren't concentrating 986 00:52:39,800 --> 00:52:41,800 rather on your subject but on keeping out of the way 987 00:52:41,880 --> 00:52:43,680 of everyone else, you'd be shouted at in, 988 00:52:43,760 --> 00:52:45,200 you know, eight different languages 989 00:52:45,280 --> 00:52:47,800 to get your elbow out of someone's picture. 990 00:52:47,880 --> 00:52:52,040 And it was an incredible sort of level of aggression, 991 00:52:52,120 --> 00:52:53,480 and competition. 992 00:52:53,560 --> 00:52:56,080 I left my cameras on the ground once. 993 00:52:56,160 --> 00:52:57,640 I thought someone was watching them for me, 994 00:52:57,720 --> 00:52:58,960 I came back and found that 995 00:52:59,040 --> 00:53:00,480 someone had fiddled with the controls 996 00:53:00,560 --> 00:53:02,800 and dialled the exposure compensation to plus three, 997 00:53:02,880 --> 00:53:06,720 so the next time I took some pictures they were ruined. 998 00:53:09,600 --> 00:53:11,880 (sighs) 999 00:53:11,960 --> 00:53:13,480 - I don't know what I'd do if I was young 1000 00:53:13,560 --> 00:53:17,720 and I had to fight with inside the business to survive. 1001 00:53:19,560 --> 00:53:22,760 - And there's a certain kind of respect 1002 00:53:22,880 --> 00:53:25,120 that the photojournalists have, 1003 00:53:26,160 --> 00:53:28,480 that when they go out they are going there 1004 00:53:28,560 --> 00:53:31,880 actually report on the people, try to do some good. 1005 00:53:31,960 --> 00:53:36,760 And then there are other people who go there who just, 1006 00:53:36,840 --> 00:53:38,640 out there for the bang bang, you know, 1007 00:53:38,720 --> 00:53:40,760 it becomes the war porn. 1008 00:53:40,840 --> 00:53:44,880 - Photojournalism has changed hugely over the years 1009 00:53:44,960 --> 00:53:48,440 that I had either been trying to become a photojournalist, 1010 00:53:48,520 --> 00:53:51,120 or actively working as one. 1011 00:53:51,200 --> 00:53:56,200 The whole myth, the whole kind of romantic image, 1012 00:53:56,400 --> 00:53:58,520 sort of purpose, 1013 00:53:58,600 --> 00:54:01,880 has changed a lot and been very diluted. 1014 00:54:01,960 --> 00:54:05,520 So, it's become really sort of 1015 00:54:05,600 --> 00:54:07,840 paparazzi for the dead and dying, 1016 00:54:07,920 --> 00:54:09,080 which kind of just leaves 1017 00:54:09,160 --> 00:54:10,920 a pretty nasty taste in your mouth. 1018 00:54:13,920 --> 00:54:16,480 The situation in Lebanon kind of traumatised me 1019 00:54:16,560 --> 00:54:20,280 quite a lot, and I was disgusted with the way 1020 00:54:20,360 --> 00:54:22,480 that I'd seen the media working there, 1021 00:54:22,560 --> 00:54:24,320 and thinking I don't want to be a news photographer, 1022 00:54:24,400 --> 00:54:27,000 I don't want to be involved in this industry. 1023 00:54:27,080 --> 00:54:28,800 I certainly don't like who I've become 1024 00:54:28,880 --> 00:54:30,000 and I don't want to become 1025 00:54:30,080 --> 00:54:32,520 anywhere near as bad as that either. 1026 00:54:32,600 --> 00:54:34,200 So I thought I'd pretty much given up. 1027 00:54:34,280 --> 00:54:36,760 But my brother who's a British soldier 1028 00:54:36,840 --> 00:54:40,160 was deployed to southern Afghanistan to Helmand province 1029 00:54:40,240 --> 00:54:42,920 in April 2007. 1030 00:54:43,000 --> 00:54:45,880 And I decided to have one last ditch attempt 1031 00:54:45,960 --> 00:54:49,120 at going to the front line and taking pictures in combat. 1032 00:54:49,200 --> 00:54:53,400 And it was kind of a, almost literally a killer cure. 1033 00:54:53,480 --> 00:54:54,880 I'll either get there and it'll totally break me 1034 00:54:54,960 --> 00:54:58,640 and I know that's the end, or I'll be back on form, 1035 00:54:58,720 --> 00:55:01,480 I'll make good pictures, I'll earn money, 1036 00:55:01,560 --> 00:55:04,240 and I'll realise this is what I want to be doing. 1037 00:55:04,320 --> 00:55:07,520 I pitched an idea to a British magazine called Arena 1038 00:55:07,600 --> 00:55:09,600 to do a story on two brothers on the front line, 1039 00:55:09,680 --> 00:55:11,920 one is photographer, one is a soldier. 1040 00:55:12,000 --> 00:55:13,560 And they jumped at the idea. 1041 00:55:15,160 --> 00:55:17,000 In order to get the airfare, 1042 00:55:17,080 --> 00:55:19,800 I sold my last remaining Leica, 1043 00:55:19,880 --> 00:55:22,200 the camera that I'd shot all the pictures in Colombia, 1044 00:55:22,280 --> 00:55:23,960 I was very attached to it. 1045 00:55:24,040 --> 00:55:26,560 But I was more attached to getting my head sorted 1046 00:55:26,640 --> 00:55:27,840 and moving forward. 1047 00:55:32,560 --> 00:55:35,120 - Listen, don't mention the war, I mentioned it once, 1048 00:55:35,200 --> 00:55:36,800 but I think I got away with it all right. 1049 00:55:36,880 --> 00:55:37,960 (laughter) So! 1050 00:55:38,040 --> 00:55:39,120 It's all forgotten now -- 1051 00:55:39,200 --> 00:55:42,120 - We sat there one night watching Faulty Towers 1052 00:55:42,200 --> 00:55:44,040 on his portable DVD player 1053 00:55:44,120 --> 00:55:45,600 when the Taliban decided to fire 1054 00:55:45,680 --> 00:55:48,480 a 105 millimetre Chinese rocket at us 1055 00:55:48,560 --> 00:55:50,200 which hit the building next to us and exploded. 1056 00:55:50,280 --> 00:55:51,920 So we sort of glanced at each other, 1057 00:55:52,000 --> 00:55:53,480 pressed pause on the DVD player, 1058 00:55:53,560 --> 00:55:55,480 put our body armour and helmets on and, 1059 00:55:55,560 --> 00:55:57,600 after saying, don't mention the war, 1060 00:55:57,680 --> 00:56:00,400 the classic Faulty Towers line, we resumed play. 1061 00:56:03,120 --> 00:56:06,400 On another patrol, I was crouching down behind a wall 1062 00:56:06,480 --> 00:56:09,280 with my brother and suddenly I saw the ANA, 1063 00:56:09,360 --> 00:56:11,800 the Afghan National Army RPG gunner 1064 00:56:11,880 --> 00:56:14,440 get up and run across a piece of open ground, 1065 00:56:14,520 --> 00:56:16,040 maybe 50 metres or so. 1066 00:56:16,120 --> 00:56:18,360 The Taliban are down here firing this way, 1067 00:56:18,440 --> 00:56:20,480 the British soldiers are on a rooftop firing this way. 1068 00:56:20,560 --> 00:56:23,200 So I looked at my brother and said, what do you think? 1069 00:56:23,280 --> 00:56:24,600 Do you think I can make it over there? 1070 00:56:24,680 --> 00:56:26,120 And he's like, pfft, 1071 00:56:26,200 --> 00:56:28,360 you can go if you like, I'm staying put. 1072 00:56:28,440 --> 00:56:31,160 And I, okay, I really, really want this picture. 1073 00:56:31,280 --> 00:56:33,560 So I sort of psyched myself up, got ready, 1074 00:56:33,680 --> 00:56:35,800 and sprinted across all this rubble 1075 00:56:35,880 --> 00:56:38,280 trying to sort of weave a bit and all this kind of thing. 1076 00:56:38,360 --> 00:56:42,200 And get down there, the guy lifts up the RPG, 1077 00:56:42,280 --> 00:56:44,040 click, click, click. 1078 00:56:44,120 --> 00:56:46,840 On the next one the RPG fires. (explosion) 1079 00:56:46,920 --> 00:56:50,160 There's only one shot that captures that split second. 1080 00:56:51,560 --> 00:56:54,200 (intense music) 1081 00:57:04,040 --> 00:57:05,280 - I think in Afghanistan, 1082 00:57:06,680 --> 00:57:11,680 Jason had set himself this impossible quest. 1083 00:57:12,680 --> 00:57:17,680 To take the perfect image which defined the war. 1084 00:57:18,960 --> 00:57:22,360 - We were based in a patrol base called Patrol Base One. 1085 00:57:22,440 --> 00:57:25,560 Jason come out to be embedded with us 1086 00:57:25,640 --> 00:57:29,920 in around July, August time. 1087 00:57:30,000 --> 00:57:35,000 Summer tour, which are always renowned to be move violent 1088 00:57:36,560 --> 00:57:39,840 and more extreme than winter tours. 1089 00:57:39,920 --> 00:57:41,360 You could say that the summer tours 1090 00:57:41,440 --> 00:57:43,960 were the start of fighting season. 1091 00:57:44,040 --> 00:57:46,680 (rapid gunfire) 1092 00:57:49,480 --> 00:57:52,560 (continuous gunfire) 1093 00:57:54,040 --> 00:57:56,360 (explosion) 1094 00:57:57,400 --> 00:57:59,240 - [Male] Fucking Hell. 1095 00:58:02,520 --> 00:58:05,880 - Why he'd want to come out to our compound, 1096 00:58:05,960 --> 00:58:08,720 to our patrol base, at that time, I don't know. 1097 00:58:10,120 --> 00:58:11,560 - Jason's an extraordinary character. 1098 00:58:11,640 --> 00:58:15,160 He would relish having as much equipment 1099 00:58:15,240 --> 00:58:16,840 as he possibly could. 1100 00:58:16,920 --> 00:58:20,440 Extra pockets, zips, flaps, body armour, a helmet, 1101 00:58:20,520 --> 00:58:24,240 you name it, if there was a gadget that Jason could carry, 1102 00:58:24,320 --> 00:58:26,080 the chances are he'd have it. 1103 00:58:26,160 --> 00:58:27,960 - He turned up, right, and when I first seen him, 1104 00:58:28,040 --> 00:58:28,920 and he was stood there, 1105 00:58:29,000 --> 00:58:32,720 he had like an American special forces helmet on, 1106 00:58:32,800 --> 00:58:35,880 and a chest rig with ammo pouches on the front. 1107 00:58:35,960 --> 00:58:37,680 But him ammo pouches didn't have ammunition in, 1108 00:58:37,760 --> 00:58:39,680 and he wasn't carrying a rifle, 1109 00:58:39,760 --> 00:58:44,400 he was carrying lenses and various camera equipment. 1110 00:58:45,960 --> 00:58:50,200 - When we were embedded with soldiers in Afghanistan, 1111 00:58:50,280 --> 00:58:53,960 I think Jason always felt a very strong affinity 1112 00:58:54,040 --> 00:58:56,400 with the troops, partly because his brother's a soldier, 1113 00:58:56,480 --> 00:58:59,120 partly because he's spent a lot of time with the soldiers. 1114 00:58:59,200 --> 00:59:01,040 He also operated with a sense of admiration 1115 00:59:01,120 --> 00:59:02,120 for what they did. 1116 00:59:05,320 --> 00:59:06,520 (chuckling) 1117 00:59:06,600 --> 00:59:09,280 - I get paid one way or the other so I don't mind. 1118 00:59:09,360 --> 00:59:11,160 Mine's for specific -- 1119 00:59:12,000 --> 00:59:15,800 - I got chatting to Jason when he was in the patrol base. 1120 00:59:15,880 --> 00:59:19,720 He was a interesting character to say the least. 1121 00:59:19,800 --> 00:59:23,080 A couple of the other freelancers that were with him said, 1122 00:59:23,160 --> 00:59:26,520 were sort of nudging him and saying he's fucking nuts. 1123 00:59:26,600 --> 00:59:29,000 (metal detector) 1124 00:59:29,080 --> 00:59:32,800 Jason was keep to get out on the patrols with the company 1125 00:59:32,880 --> 00:59:34,680 and get out on the ground. 1126 00:59:34,760 --> 00:59:37,680 He accompanied a few patrols out 1127 00:59:37,760 --> 00:59:40,680 when they were maneuvering through the AD clearance 1128 00:59:40,800 --> 00:59:43,680 going on at the south of the patrol base. 1129 00:59:47,960 --> 00:59:50,200 (clanging) 1130 00:59:54,200 --> 00:59:55,280 - Fire! 1131 00:59:55,360 --> 00:59:57,720 (explosion) 1132 01:00:06,040 --> 01:00:09,640 - I don't think the public fully understand 1133 01:00:11,480 --> 01:00:14,840 the severity of conflict because they're, 1134 01:00:16,600 --> 01:00:18,240 it's hidden from them. 1135 01:00:18,320 --> 01:00:22,120 They only get certain bits and pieces 1136 01:00:22,200 --> 01:00:25,200 via mainstream media. 1137 01:00:25,280 --> 01:00:29,040 They're not exposed to the full severity of conflicts 1138 01:00:29,120 --> 01:00:31,080 and what it involves. 1139 01:00:31,160 --> 01:00:33,200 (popping) 1140 01:00:33,280 --> 01:00:35,440 (yelling) - Shot! 1141 01:00:35,520 --> 01:00:36,840 - Man down! - You all right? 1142 01:00:36,920 --> 01:00:38,160 - Man down! - Man down! 1143 01:00:38,240 --> 01:00:40,600 - Man down! - Man down! 1144 01:00:40,680 --> 01:00:42,240 - [Soldier] Medic, get a medic! 1145 01:00:43,960 --> 01:00:46,760 - [Soldier] It's not me, mate, it's not me! 1146 01:00:50,480 --> 01:00:51,360 - It's vital, 1147 01:00:51,440 --> 01:00:55,400 if the general public are funding the armed forces, 1148 01:00:55,480 --> 01:00:58,720 that we do find out what happens to our guys on the ground. 1149 01:01:00,360 --> 01:01:02,800 And in this case, this is completely unique. 1150 01:01:02,880 --> 01:01:06,120 We've never been able to before tell a story 1151 01:01:06,200 --> 01:01:09,680 of a soldier sustaining serious injury 1152 01:01:09,760 --> 01:01:13,800 and also going through the rehabilitation process. 1153 01:01:13,880 --> 01:01:18,240 - In the final stages of the attempts to 1154 01:01:21,480 --> 01:01:24,040 get authorization from the MoD for the pictures, 1155 01:01:25,680 --> 01:01:27,520 the emails I received from them 1156 01:01:28,960 --> 01:01:32,040 stated that the pictures, 1157 01:01:35,240 --> 01:01:38,280 that the pictures of Stephen on the ground, 1158 01:01:38,360 --> 01:01:40,920 injured, had not been cleared, 1159 01:01:41,000 --> 01:01:44,720 and that they did not intend to clear them. 1160 01:01:44,800 --> 01:01:47,240 - I'm really keen not to give anyone an excuse 1161 01:01:47,320 --> 01:01:50,240 to just impose their personal feeling 1162 01:01:50,320 --> 01:01:53,840 on the picture not being used, and I, 1163 01:01:53,920 --> 01:01:56,400 as long as the pictures are not going to upset the casualty, 1164 01:01:56,480 --> 01:01:57,720 which we've determined they're not, 1165 01:01:57,800 --> 01:02:00,200 and they're not going to put anyone in danger, 1166 01:02:00,280 --> 01:02:02,560 I'm not sure what the other issue is 1167 01:02:03,680 --> 01:02:06,400 that can be imposed on this. 1168 01:02:06,480 --> 01:02:08,600 One thing that was mentioned during the phone conversation 1169 01:02:08,680 --> 01:02:11,640 was that in fact it was the policy 1170 01:02:11,720 --> 01:02:12,640 of the Ministry of Defence 1171 01:02:12,720 --> 01:02:15,440 to not allow the publication of images 1172 01:02:15,520 --> 01:02:18,120 that show injuries to soldiers. 1173 01:02:18,200 --> 01:02:20,160 He told me that the last time that such images 1174 01:02:20,240 --> 01:02:22,360 had been published would've been about 30 years ago 1175 01:02:22,440 --> 01:02:24,560 during the Falkland's conflict, 1176 01:02:24,640 --> 01:02:26,960 and that basically the Ministry of Defence 1177 01:02:27,040 --> 01:02:28,680 would be pretty upset 1178 01:02:28,760 --> 01:02:31,080 if the pictures that we used were graphic. 1179 01:02:33,000 --> 01:02:34,040 - British Ministry of Defence 1180 01:02:34,120 --> 01:02:37,440 hides behind the argument of privacy 1181 01:02:37,520 --> 01:02:40,720 in order to prevent British newspapers 1182 01:02:40,800 --> 01:02:42,280 and British journalists for any newspaper, 1183 01:02:42,360 --> 01:02:46,720 any journalist from publishing pictures of wounded soldiers 1184 01:02:46,800 --> 01:02:50,600 because they argue that it's the soldier's right to privacy. 1185 01:02:50,720 --> 01:02:53,000 - And the argument at this stage, 1186 01:02:53,080 --> 01:02:58,080 since we now had the, we had Stephen's approval to do that, 1187 01:02:58,400 --> 01:03:00,720 was that it wasn't his decision to make. 1188 01:03:01,640 --> 01:03:03,840 So initially the argument was that 1189 01:03:03,920 --> 01:03:07,000 they were protecting patient confidentiality, 1190 01:03:07,080 --> 01:03:11,360 and now because the patient had decided and signed a release 1191 01:03:11,440 --> 01:03:13,480 stipulating that he was prepared 1192 01:03:13,560 --> 01:03:16,120 to give up that confidentiality, 1193 01:03:16,200 --> 01:03:20,800 then the reasons for not publishing the pictures 1194 01:03:20,880 --> 01:03:23,440 was changed. 1195 01:03:23,520 --> 01:03:27,360 - The editor's concern is for the -- 1196 01:03:27,440 --> 01:03:29,080 - Soldier? - The casualty, the soldier. 1197 01:03:29,160 --> 01:03:29,920 - Right. 1198 01:03:30,000 --> 01:03:30,840 - And for the readers. - Yeah. 1199 01:03:30,920 --> 01:03:32,360 - I mean, he said that? 1200 01:03:32,440 --> 01:03:33,160 - Yeah. 1201 01:03:33,240 --> 01:03:34,840 - Okay, I mean, I have the signed release in my bag, 1202 01:03:34,920 --> 01:03:37,160 so he can be assured that the casualty's happy. 1203 01:03:37,240 --> 01:03:39,400 - So he's absolutely good to go. 1204 01:03:40,400 --> 01:03:43,040 (ominous music) 1205 01:03:53,080 --> 01:03:55,640 - Just because they tell me that they have a policy, 1206 01:03:55,720 --> 01:03:58,840 that doesn't mean I'm going to accept it or agree with it. 1207 01:03:58,920 --> 01:04:00,480 I do not work for the Ministry of Defence, 1208 01:04:00,560 --> 01:04:01,640 I do not work for the government, 1209 01:04:01,720 --> 01:04:06,600 my job is not just to show the good side of things 1210 01:04:06,680 --> 01:04:09,360 and the side that they want to be shown, 1211 01:04:09,440 --> 01:04:11,600 it is to show the reality of it. 1212 01:04:12,920 --> 01:04:15,480 And that sometimes is messy. 1213 01:04:17,440 --> 01:04:20,640 - What the MoD, the DOD, whoever the fuck they are, 1214 01:04:20,720 --> 01:04:21,560 Pentagon, 1215 01:04:22,880 --> 01:04:24,240 doesn't want, 1216 01:04:25,720 --> 01:04:30,680 they don't want war to be unappetizing. 1217 01:04:30,760 --> 01:04:33,200 It's got to remain good, 1218 01:04:33,280 --> 01:04:36,520 because otherwise you can't get people to join up anymore, 1219 01:04:36,600 --> 01:04:38,000 there's no more draught. 1220 01:04:38,080 --> 01:04:39,920 - Several months later, 1221 01:04:40,920 --> 01:04:44,240 I received a request from The Telegraph 1222 01:04:44,320 --> 01:04:46,600 to return to Afghanistan 1223 01:04:46,680 --> 01:04:50,760 to go on another embed with Thomas Harding, 1224 01:04:50,840 --> 01:04:52,720 the defence correspondent. 1225 01:04:52,800 --> 01:04:55,480 - And pretty close to the last minute, 1226 01:04:55,560 --> 01:04:58,000 the MoD said no, you can't take that photographer with you, 1227 01:04:58,080 --> 01:04:59,440 you can't take Jason, you can take any other photographer, 1228 01:04:59,520 --> 01:05:00,840 but apart from him. 1229 01:05:02,720 --> 01:05:07,720 - Which would seem to rather conflict with the assurance 1230 01:05:08,720 --> 01:05:10,920 that their senior representative 1231 01:05:11,000 --> 01:05:14,080 had previously sent me in writing 1232 01:05:14,160 --> 01:05:15,920 that there would be, 1233 01:05:16,000 --> 01:05:19,360 that publishing those images would have no negative effect 1234 01:05:19,440 --> 01:05:21,440 on my future embed requests. 1235 01:05:22,600 --> 01:05:27,080 - And if a journalist dares to try and report information 1236 01:05:27,160 --> 01:05:29,560 from the front line which the Ministry of Defence 1237 01:05:29,640 --> 01:05:32,520 is uncomfortable with, in a number of cases, 1238 01:05:32,600 --> 01:05:34,560 effectively blacklisted journalists. 1239 01:05:41,440 --> 01:05:44,720 - Jason was banned from going to Afghanistan by the MoD 1240 01:05:44,800 --> 01:05:47,360 which was, for a person who's a great war photographer, 1241 01:05:47,440 --> 01:05:49,080 quite a blow, I think. 1242 01:05:49,160 --> 01:05:52,400 - The truth is is that the British Ministry of Defence 1243 01:05:52,480 --> 01:05:56,040 did not want the British public to see pictures 1244 01:05:56,160 --> 01:06:00,480 of British soldiers being wounded or killed in Afghanistan. 1245 01:06:00,560 --> 01:06:04,560 And therefore they used the agreements they had in place, 1246 01:06:04,640 --> 01:06:06,880 and I'd say they abused the agreements they had in place 1247 01:06:06,960 --> 01:06:11,080 to make sure those pictures rarely, if ever, got published. 1248 01:06:12,800 --> 01:06:14,160 - It's a tribute to Jason, 1249 01:06:14,240 --> 01:06:16,480 and it's a tribute to Private Bainbridge, 1250 01:06:16,560 --> 01:06:19,920 and it's a tribute to the soldiers that helped both of them, 1251 01:06:20,000 --> 01:06:22,480 that those images did eventually come out. 1252 01:06:22,560 --> 01:06:27,000 - I didn't compromise any journalistic integrity, 1253 01:06:27,080 --> 01:06:31,200 and I didn't allow the work to be censored. 1254 01:06:31,280 --> 01:06:33,920 And I didn't let down any of the soldiers 1255 01:06:34,880 --> 01:06:38,760 whose story I swore I would tell. 1256 01:06:38,840 --> 01:06:41,000 When I was there on the ground with them, 1257 01:06:41,080 --> 01:06:45,360 I promised them that I would get that story published. 1258 01:06:45,440 --> 01:06:47,520 And that's what I did. 1259 01:06:58,360 --> 01:07:01,480 - Without a doubt, war photography is an addiction. 1260 01:07:02,320 --> 01:07:05,720 What really matters is how you manage that addiction. 1261 01:07:08,920 --> 01:07:11,280 There's definitely two faces to Jason. 1262 01:07:11,360 --> 01:07:13,320 When he's on the job, he's very serious, 1263 01:07:13,400 --> 01:07:15,760 very hardworking, he's no bullshit. 1264 01:07:17,400 --> 01:07:21,640 When he's not on the job, he's kind of a clown. 1265 01:07:21,720 --> 01:07:23,120 Which I love about him. 1266 01:07:23,200 --> 01:07:26,480 I love the fact that he can put on both of those hats 1267 01:07:26,560 --> 01:07:29,320 and not have to carry this whole persona 1268 01:07:29,400 --> 01:07:32,280 as a war photographer, although he does. 1269 01:07:32,360 --> 01:07:33,920 Don't get me wrong. 1270 01:07:34,000 --> 01:07:35,520 - Why did this big fat dude come here? 1271 01:07:35,600 --> 01:07:37,000 - [Woman] We need to have a toast. 1272 01:07:37,080 --> 01:07:39,360 - [Man] Stop fiddling with your cellphone watching poetry. 1273 01:07:39,440 --> 01:07:41,000 - [Eros] I'd go anywhere with Jason 1274 01:07:41,080 --> 01:07:42,640 except to a cocktail party. 1275 01:07:45,360 --> 01:07:47,600 (laughing) 1276 01:07:50,120 --> 01:07:53,880 - The thing is though I was like so completely off my face 1277 01:07:53,960 --> 01:07:54,720 that I was thinking -- 1278 01:07:54,800 --> 01:07:56,680 - The survivor's euphoria is great. 1279 01:07:57,960 --> 01:07:59,320 Until it's not. 1280 01:08:00,400 --> 01:08:01,760 But decompressing. 1281 01:08:06,120 --> 01:08:08,520 Drugs and alcohol is the obvious one. 1282 01:08:09,400 --> 01:08:12,800 (discordant music) 1283 01:08:12,880 --> 01:08:15,080 - I think perhaps as much of a thrill seeker 1284 01:08:15,920 --> 01:08:20,000 in his private life as he is in his profession life, 1285 01:08:20,080 --> 01:08:24,680 as a photographer, his social life was often as fast paced, 1286 01:08:24,760 --> 01:08:27,400 and some would even say as dangerous 1287 01:08:27,480 --> 01:08:29,560 or as risky as his professional life. 1288 01:08:29,640 --> 01:08:31,600 - I told him this many times, I said, 1289 01:08:31,680 --> 01:08:33,640 you're safer in Afghanistan being shot at 1290 01:08:33,720 --> 01:08:35,240 than you are here in Bangkok 1291 01:08:35,320 --> 01:08:37,320 because of the way you're behaving here. 1292 01:08:38,400 --> 01:08:41,080 - We've decided it's better to leave on a high note, 1293 01:08:41,160 --> 01:08:43,400 so, let's go and get high. 1294 01:08:44,600 --> 01:08:47,000 Or drunk as the case may be. 1295 01:08:47,080 --> 01:08:48,680 Just in case Mum's watching. 1296 01:08:52,160 --> 01:08:54,640 - He'd drink everything, he'd fuck everything, 1297 01:08:54,720 --> 01:08:56,440 he'd snort everything and then he'd just wake up 1298 01:08:56,520 --> 01:08:58,720 like an angry bear and then he'd just do it all over again, 1299 01:08:58,800 --> 01:09:00,840 I mean it was just insane, and I would tell him, 1300 01:09:00,920 --> 01:09:02,680 you cannot keep doing this to yourself, 1301 01:09:02,760 --> 01:09:04,000 it's just out of control. 1302 01:09:06,360 --> 01:09:07,920 - As has happened in the past 1303 01:09:08,040 --> 01:09:10,000 when I've bene in places like Thailand 1304 01:09:10,080 --> 01:09:11,400 and I've been partying too hard 1305 01:09:11,480 --> 01:09:12,720 and I've looked in the mirror and thought, 1306 01:09:12,800 --> 01:09:15,120 if I keep on like this, 1307 01:09:15,200 --> 01:09:17,040 my friend Roger Arnold is probably gonna be 1308 01:09:17,120 --> 01:09:20,160 coming around and identifying my corpse next week. 1309 01:09:20,240 --> 01:09:24,320 So it's time to call the airline, change that flight, 1310 01:09:24,400 --> 01:09:27,920 and get back to that wonderful detox zone, Afghanistan. 1311 01:09:30,440 --> 01:09:33,600 (contemplative music) 1312 01:09:35,360 --> 01:09:37,320 Because of the teachings of the Jehovah's Witness' 1313 01:09:37,400 --> 01:09:39,920 I was brought up to have no fear of death, 1314 01:09:40,000 --> 01:09:44,200 and that's one thing that I am actually really grateful for. 1315 01:09:45,080 --> 01:09:46,800 Whilst I would, 1316 01:09:46,880 --> 01:09:49,800 obviously I'm concerned about getting seriously injured 1317 01:09:49,880 --> 01:09:51,720 and having to live with a disability 1318 01:09:51,800 --> 01:09:54,720 or missing limbs or something like that, 1319 01:09:54,800 --> 01:09:59,800 the idea that when I'm dead, that's it, it's the end, 1320 01:09:59,920 --> 01:10:02,720 which is quite liberating. 1321 01:10:02,800 --> 01:10:04,720 I can't imagine what it would be like to be a Catholic 1322 01:10:04,800 --> 01:10:06,480 and be worrying that perhaps 1323 01:10:06,560 --> 01:10:09,640 I'm gonna have to somehow pay for all of these mistakes 1324 01:10:09,720 --> 01:10:12,160 that I've made and all of the bad behaviour 1325 01:10:12,240 --> 01:10:14,000 over the last however many years. 1326 01:10:16,240 --> 01:10:18,160 And it just makes me think, well, 1327 01:10:18,240 --> 01:10:21,440 should be enjoying every moment up until 1328 01:10:21,520 --> 01:10:23,240 the moment that the lights go out. 1329 01:10:24,240 --> 01:10:27,200 (sinister music) 1330 01:10:27,280 --> 01:10:31,080 Karen Woo was a good friend of Jason's, she was a doctor. 1331 01:10:31,160 --> 01:10:34,960 - Who gave up a very good job in the UK 1332 01:10:35,040 --> 01:10:38,400 to go out to Afghanistan and work as a volunteer 1333 01:10:38,480 --> 01:10:40,640 to set up a sort of medical camp 1334 01:10:40,720 --> 01:10:43,160 in the mountains of Nuristan to help out the locals 1335 01:10:43,240 --> 01:10:46,720 who had no access to medical facilities. 1336 01:10:46,800 --> 01:10:51,000 She was one of these people that lights any place 1337 01:10:51,080 --> 01:10:53,800 and any situation up with her personality. 1338 01:10:53,880 --> 01:10:57,640 But the problem with living in a place like Afghanistan 1339 01:10:57,720 --> 01:11:01,640 and with being involved in a profession like this one 1340 01:11:01,720 --> 01:11:04,320 is that there's always bad news. 1341 01:11:05,640 --> 01:11:08,800 - She was murdered in northeastern Afghanistan 1342 01:11:08,880 --> 01:11:12,920 by the Taliban, and that really broke Jason up. 1343 01:11:13,000 --> 01:11:15,640 - However on the evening of that day 1344 01:11:15,720 --> 01:11:17,920 that the news had come in. 1345 01:11:18,000 --> 01:11:21,800 - We were having a small party at his rented house in Kabul. 1346 01:11:23,320 --> 01:11:25,840 - Induced by a fair amount of alcohol 1347 01:11:25,920 --> 01:11:28,760 I basically had a bit of a meltdown 1348 01:11:28,840 --> 01:11:30,840 and ended up kind of sobbing, 1349 01:11:30,920 --> 01:11:32,440 and I remember Eros putting his arms around me 1350 01:11:32,520 --> 01:11:34,880 and telling me that he knew, he knew about loss, 1351 01:11:34,960 --> 01:11:36,520 he knew how I felt. 1352 01:11:36,600 --> 01:11:37,880 - And Jason's just like, 1353 01:11:38,880 --> 01:11:39,960 losing it, and he just broke down 1354 01:11:40,040 --> 01:11:42,800 and just started weeping in my lap. 1355 01:11:42,880 --> 01:11:46,080 He was just like, like a child all of a sudden. 1356 01:11:46,160 --> 01:11:51,160 - This is how kind of the grief and emotions come out, 1357 01:11:51,440 --> 01:11:52,520 they don't, 1358 01:11:52,600 --> 01:11:56,920 they don't come out in the moment of receiving the news, 1359 01:11:57,000 --> 01:11:59,000 because there is an element of shock, 1360 01:11:59,080 --> 01:12:01,600 or an element of having really just 1361 01:12:01,680 --> 01:12:04,920 learned how to control your emotions, 1362 01:12:05,000 --> 01:12:07,240 because you are consistently witnessing 1363 01:12:07,320 --> 01:12:09,760 negative and traumatic things. 1364 01:12:09,840 --> 01:12:12,840 - It was just the beginning of, 1365 01:12:14,280 --> 01:12:17,680 the end, let's say, of a stage of Jason's life 1366 01:12:17,760 --> 01:12:21,160 where he was really beginning to understand 1367 01:12:21,240 --> 01:12:26,240 that he's got to, he's gotta make some changes 1368 01:12:27,440 --> 01:12:32,440 if he is to keep any kind of content, happy future. 1369 01:12:36,560 --> 01:12:38,120 Oh, there's no doubt about it 1370 01:12:38,200 --> 01:12:41,040 that Jason suffers from post-traumatic stress. 1371 01:12:41,120 --> 01:12:44,400 Without a doubt, and I know that because I suffer from it. 1372 01:12:44,480 --> 01:12:48,160 I see it so easily, in him, and many people. 1373 01:12:48,240 --> 01:12:50,240 The post-traumatic stress is deeply rooted. 1374 01:12:50,320 --> 01:12:54,720 It comes from before the war photography. 1375 01:12:54,800 --> 01:12:59,800 - I think the subjects he's chosen to get involved with 1376 01:13:01,160 --> 01:13:04,360 have overtaken him, overcome him. 1377 01:13:05,440 --> 01:13:07,680 (crickets) 1378 01:13:22,640 --> 01:13:26,600 - Being exposed to so much trauma in our adult lives 1379 01:13:26,680 --> 01:13:30,560 has just intensified it all, and brought it up in, 1380 01:13:30,640 --> 01:13:32,840 and maybe it's a really good thing 1381 01:13:32,920 --> 01:13:34,320 because it's brought it up in a way 1382 01:13:34,400 --> 01:13:36,400 that it's easily identifiable now. 1383 01:13:37,840 --> 01:13:40,440 (sombre music) 1384 01:13:43,840 --> 01:13:45,680 - How could he not be suffering from PTSD? 1385 01:13:45,760 --> 01:13:49,640 I mean I think, he would not be human if he wasn't. 1386 01:13:49,720 --> 01:13:52,160 And he's pretty human, he's extra human. 1387 01:13:55,280 --> 01:13:57,840 - Going to conflict areas and hostile environments 1388 01:13:57,920 --> 01:14:00,640 and witnessing high levels of trauma, 1389 01:14:02,280 --> 01:14:04,560 you're not gonna come back the same person, 1390 01:14:04,640 --> 01:14:05,960 and that's a fucking fact. 1391 01:14:10,280 --> 01:14:12,960 - Despite all his bravado and war stuff, 1392 01:14:13,040 --> 01:14:14,160 he's a pretty sensitive guy. 1393 01:14:14,240 --> 01:14:16,440 I think he takes things pretty hard, too, sometimes, 1394 01:14:16,520 --> 01:14:18,240 and I think the stuff that he's seen 1395 01:14:18,320 --> 01:14:20,240 and things have happened to him in other wars, 1396 01:14:20,320 --> 01:14:22,440 and he's had some close calls, I think it's, 1397 01:14:22,520 --> 01:14:24,720 I think it's had a pretty heavy toll on him. 1398 01:14:26,480 --> 01:14:29,320 (unnerving music) 1399 01:14:36,320 --> 01:14:38,280 - The damage done... 1400 01:14:41,240 --> 01:14:43,520 Distracts you from a lot of purpose. 1401 01:14:45,880 --> 01:14:46,680 It, 1402 01:14:50,360 --> 01:14:53,040 makes you look for strange escape routes. 1403 01:14:56,240 --> 01:14:59,000 - You can run from your demons until you're exhausted, 1404 01:15:00,000 --> 01:15:01,240 but one day you'll have to stop 1405 01:15:01,320 --> 01:15:02,800 and find out what they wanted. 1406 01:15:02,880 --> 01:15:05,120 So the only option for me really 1407 01:15:05,200 --> 01:15:07,160 was a complete lifestyle change. 1408 01:15:08,360 --> 01:15:12,840 Probably for many years I've been running from 1409 01:15:12,920 --> 01:15:14,320 one set of demons or another, 1410 01:15:14,400 --> 01:15:17,240 and quite often the next situation that you're in 1411 01:15:17,320 --> 01:15:20,240 just creates a whole load of new demons. 1412 01:15:20,320 --> 01:15:23,560 But the key really to winning any fight 1413 01:15:23,680 --> 01:15:26,200 is choosing the battleground. 1414 01:15:26,280 --> 01:15:28,840 So this is one of the main motivations 1415 01:15:28,920 --> 01:15:30,520 for moving to Andalusia, 1416 01:15:31,640 --> 01:15:33,960 so that I could pick and choose the time and place 1417 01:15:34,040 --> 01:15:35,280 when I would deal with these demons, 1418 01:15:35,360 --> 01:15:38,160 as opposed to trying to deal with them 1419 01:15:38,240 --> 01:15:40,320 in a war zone or something like that. 1420 01:15:40,400 --> 01:15:41,760 Or, 1421 01:15:41,840 --> 01:15:44,000 maybe in the sort of, 1422 01:15:45,240 --> 01:15:47,440 cycle of ways I'd had of dealing with things. 1423 01:15:47,520 --> 01:15:50,360 Maybe going to Thailand for three months a year 1424 01:15:50,440 --> 01:15:52,520 and just drinking and partying and so on, 1425 01:15:52,600 --> 01:15:55,560 and trying to get some sort of, 1426 01:15:55,640 --> 01:15:57,600 well I thought trying to get some kind of head space 1427 01:15:57,680 --> 01:16:00,040 from dealing with the problems of the war zones. 1428 01:16:00,120 --> 01:16:01,080 But of course just creating 1429 01:16:01,160 --> 01:16:03,600 a whole new set of problems, really. 1430 01:16:03,680 --> 01:16:06,000 - I was enormously fortunate, 1431 01:16:06,080 --> 01:16:08,600 when I had PTSD or was diagnosed with PTSD 1432 01:16:08,680 --> 01:16:11,760 that I was a staff correspondent. 1433 01:16:13,320 --> 01:16:15,720 I was able to get medical treatment, 1434 01:16:15,800 --> 01:16:17,920 I was off work for six months, 1435 01:16:18,000 --> 01:16:20,600 all of those things were given to me. 1436 01:16:22,200 --> 01:16:25,520 That would not happen with a freelancer, it's much harder. 1437 01:16:28,280 --> 01:16:30,280 - When I first got here, 1438 01:16:30,360 --> 01:16:35,200 this was in the months immediately after the IED strike 1439 01:16:35,280 --> 01:16:37,640 in Helmand. 1440 01:16:37,720 --> 01:16:39,840 I was stressing a lot about 1441 01:16:39,920 --> 01:16:41,680 whether I was gonna be able to get permission 1442 01:16:41,760 --> 01:16:44,960 to publish the pictures of the wounded soldier, 1443 01:16:45,040 --> 01:16:46,600 pictures that I felt very strongly about 1444 01:16:46,680 --> 01:16:48,360 because I was aware that they were really 1445 01:16:48,440 --> 01:16:50,560 the only ones of a wounded British soldier 1446 01:16:50,640 --> 01:16:52,320 still on the battlefield. 1447 01:16:52,400 --> 01:16:56,320 And I didn't want to ever be left with the feeling 1448 01:16:56,400 --> 01:17:00,040 that I'd taken those epic risks that day, 1449 01:17:00,120 --> 01:17:02,280 in particular, to get those pictures, 1450 01:17:02,360 --> 01:17:05,400 and then no one was ever gonna see them. 1451 01:17:05,480 --> 01:17:09,280 They were going to be basically censored out by the MoD. 1452 01:17:12,960 --> 01:17:15,160 So the pattern of life has changed here a lot really 1453 01:17:15,240 --> 01:17:16,840 because when I first got here, 1454 01:17:17,760 --> 01:17:20,040 I wasn't particularly healthy, 1455 01:17:20,120 --> 01:17:23,080 and I certainly wasn't dealing with any of those demons 1456 01:17:23,160 --> 01:17:24,480 at that stage. 1457 01:17:24,560 --> 01:17:26,520 I was really creating new ones. 1458 01:17:28,200 --> 01:17:31,600 My nights were kind of pretty regularly disturbed 1459 01:17:31,680 --> 01:17:33,240 by nightmares. 1460 01:17:35,080 --> 01:17:36,240 Generally, 1461 01:17:36,320 --> 01:17:38,680 I could never really identify anything specific 1462 01:17:38,760 --> 01:17:41,440 in the nightmare, so it wasn't, for example, 1463 01:17:41,520 --> 01:17:46,160 I would be witnessing the IED strike 1464 01:17:46,240 --> 01:17:48,040 when Bainbridge lost his legs, for example, 1465 01:17:48,120 --> 01:17:49,240 or anything like that. 1466 01:17:50,560 --> 01:17:53,200 They were nearly always kind of hypothetical situations, 1467 01:17:53,280 --> 01:17:56,560 and generally involved a situation 1468 01:17:56,640 --> 01:17:58,800 that I needed to escape from or, 1469 01:17:58,880 --> 01:18:02,160 a situation where I was fighting. 1470 01:18:02,240 --> 01:18:06,160 In my nightmares I used to kill quite a lot of people. 1471 01:18:06,240 --> 01:18:09,600 I used to quite regularly kill my brother 1472 01:18:09,680 --> 01:18:11,400 by crushing his head with rocks. 1473 01:18:12,520 --> 01:18:14,760 All sorts of like, really, just, 1474 01:18:14,840 --> 01:18:16,120 dreadful, frightening things, really. 1475 01:18:16,200 --> 01:18:19,760 You just wake up sort of in a cold sweat, shaking, 1476 01:18:19,840 --> 01:18:22,440 and exhausted, when you woke up in the morning 1477 01:18:22,520 --> 01:18:23,800 with your neck and shoulders aching 1478 01:18:23,880 --> 01:18:25,480 because you'd spent all night fighting 1479 01:18:25,560 --> 01:18:27,680 and struggling and trying to escape. 1480 01:18:28,960 --> 01:18:31,600 And they have gradually diminished. 1481 01:18:31,720 --> 01:18:34,720 I now just kind of have really weird dreams. 1482 01:18:34,800 --> 01:18:36,160 Like last night I dreamt 1483 01:18:36,240 --> 01:18:37,680 I was in the British Prime Minister's house 1484 01:18:37,760 --> 01:18:41,080 giving him some advice on interior decorating. 1485 01:18:41,160 --> 01:18:43,920 And for some reason he had a picture of me on the wall. 1486 01:18:44,000 --> 01:18:46,120 So yeah, be interesting to see 1487 01:18:46,200 --> 01:18:48,560 what the psychotherapist has to say about that. 1488 01:18:52,480 --> 01:18:56,400 The problems I had were that I couldn't really switch off 1489 01:18:57,240 --> 01:19:02,000 from thinking about my security and my safety 1490 01:19:02,080 --> 01:19:03,240 and that kind of thing because, 1491 01:19:03,320 --> 01:19:06,480 it's been 12 years really that I spent living in places 1492 01:19:06,560 --> 01:19:09,680 like Iraq and Afghanistan and Colombia and so on. 1493 01:19:09,760 --> 01:19:13,520 Places where loud noises in the night 1494 01:19:13,600 --> 01:19:17,560 are generally a precursor to something bad happening. 1495 01:19:22,280 --> 01:19:26,240 So one of the big things that really made 1496 01:19:26,320 --> 01:19:29,480 a great difference here was having the dogs. 1497 01:19:30,920 --> 01:19:32,800 When I first got here, if they barked in the night, 1498 01:19:32,880 --> 01:19:35,240 I would get up and go out with a flashlight 1499 01:19:35,320 --> 01:19:37,400 and have a look around and see what it was. 1500 01:19:37,480 --> 01:19:40,760 And I was very, 1501 01:19:40,840 --> 01:19:42,600 well, still very much sort of paranoid 1502 01:19:42,680 --> 01:19:44,320 and on edge a lot, all the time. 1503 01:19:44,400 --> 01:19:47,920 At one stage I was actually even sleeping on the balcony 1504 01:19:48,000 --> 01:19:51,080 outside because it meant I could come into the house, 1505 01:19:51,160 --> 01:19:54,760 I could close the door, I could then go upstairs, 1506 01:19:54,840 --> 01:19:58,400 which is the furthest away from the obvious entry points, 1507 01:19:58,480 --> 01:20:01,240 and I could then go outside and lock another set of doors 1508 01:20:01,320 --> 01:20:02,320 and then sleep on the balcony. 1509 01:20:02,400 --> 01:20:04,360 So that if something bad happened, 1510 01:20:04,440 --> 01:20:05,960 all I've got to do is drop off the balcony 1511 01:20:06,040 --> 01:20:07,880 and sort of head off into the bushes. 1512 01:20:09,040 --> 01:20:11,400 (panting) 1513 01:20:11,480 --> 01:20:12,480 Here you go. 1514 01:20:17,960 --> 01:20:21,200 Taking away all of the emotional crutches, 1515 01:20:21,280 --> 01:20:22,720 or I don't know if they're emotional crutches, 1516 01:20:22,800 --> 01:20:26,160 but they're just crutches that help you get through, 1517 01:20:26,240 --> 01:20:29,120 through stuff, whether that is drinking, or smoking, 1518 01:20:29,200 --> 01:20:31,920 or taking drugs, or whatever it is you do 1519 01:20:32,000 --> 01:20:34,360 to distract you away from actually dealing with 1520 01:20:34,440 --> 01:20:37,080 the issue at hand, once you take all those away, 1521 01:20:37,160 --> 01:20:38,920 the only thing you're left with 1522 01:20:39,000 --> 01:20:41,160 is the problems and dealing with them. 1523 01:20:42,520 --> 01:20:45,280 Your emotions are now, like, really sharp, 1524 01:20:45,360 --> 01:20:49,440 and you're gonna start having normal reactions to things. 1525 01:20:49,520 --> 01:20:51,440 And that's quite hard to deal with, 1526 01:20:51,520 --> 01:20:52,960 because if you've had several years 1527 01:20:53,040 --> 01:20:55,760 of emotional reaction management, 1528 01:20:55,840 --> 01:20:57,400 and you've become an expert in it, 1529 01:20:57,480 --> 01:21:00,400 to suddenly start having feelings again is pretty, 1530 01:21:02,240 --> 01:21:04,440 is a difficult situation to deal with. 1531 01:21:12,440 --> 01:21:15,840 Your emotional release will sometimes come 1532 01:21:15,920 --> 01:21:17,080 when you're least expecting it. 1533 01:21:17,160 --> 01:21:19,960 I would find it would come in the most insane times, 1534 01:21:20,040 --> 01:21:23,360 be watching a chick flick, eyes are welling up with tears, 1535 01:21:23,440 --> 01:21:25,680 and your Adam's apple's bobbing up and down. 1536 01:21:25,760 --> 01:21:28,560 Or Lassie dies at the end of the film or something 1537 01:21:28,640 --> 01:21:30,400 and you're like, bawling your eyes out. 1538 01:21:30,480 --> 01:21:31,320 And people are looking at you 1539 01:21:31,400 --> 01:21:33,720 as thought you're completely mad, which, 1540 01:21:33,800 --> 01:21:35,880 clearly, I was. 1541 01:21:36,840 --> 01:21:39,200 But back then I couldn't really understand 1542 01:21:39,320 --> 01:21:40,560 why those things were happening. 1543 01:21:40,680 --> 01:21:42,360 I think also it takes a long time 1544 01:21:42,440 --> 01:21:44,160 to get those emotions back in balance. 1545 01:21:44,240 --> 01:21:48,080 And I wouldn't say certainly now that they're in balance, 1546 01:21:48,160 --> 01:21:51,680 but they will at last be heading in the right direction. 1547 01:21:52,920 --> 01:21:54,840 (laughing) 1548 01:21:54,920 --> 01:21:57,960 Too many kisses, too much love, too much love. 1549 01:22:00,240 --> 01:22:04,480 (contemplative instrumental music) 1550 01:22:10,080 --> 01:22:12,920 - I think his Colombian work, it was his best, 1551 01:22:13,000 --> 01:22:14,960 it was really incredible. 1552 01:22:15,040 --> 01:22:19,200 And that one image encapsulates his whole entire career 1553 01:22:19,280 --> 01:22:22,880 before he even had a career, oddly enough. 1554 01:22:22,960 --> 01:22:24,200 It's almost in reverse. 1555 01:22:25,160 --> 01:22:27,600 - One of the things that has motivated me 1556 01:22:27,680 --> 01:22:30,000 in my photography, and still does motivate me, 1557 01:22:30,080 --> 01:22:31,640 and would make me perhaps want to go back 1558 01:22:31,720 --> 01:22:34,800 and do that kind of work again once I've got myself 1559 01:22:34,880 --> 01:22:38,200 in a better mental and emotional place and so on, 1560 01:22:38,280 --> 01:22:41,040 is that I really love the idea of shaking people 1561 01:22:41,120 --> 01:22:44,000 out of their horrible little insulated bubbles. 1562 01:22:45,720 --> 01:22:49,560 (yelling in foreign language) 1563 01:23:01,120 --> 01:23:03,880 (camera shutter) 1564 01:23:12,760 --> 01:23:15,520 (camera shutter) 1565 01:23:20,120 --> 01:23:22,880 (camera shutter) 1566 01:23:25,000 --> 01:23:26,000 - [Male] Come on, man, show me the tat. 1567 01:23:26,080 --> 01:23:27,800 - No, it's too cold. 1568 01:23:27,880 --> 01:23:28,800 - [Male] You got a t-shirt on. 1569 01:23:28,880 --> 01:23:29,640 - No! 1570 01:23:29,720 --> 01:23:31,920 I've got a long sleeve thermal fleece. 1571 01:23:32,000 --> 01:23:33,240 Oh, microphone. 1572 01:23:34,200 --> 01:23:37,160 Just because at least one person's gotten, 1573 01:23:37,240 --> 01:23:39,360 what the fuck is going on with me? 1574 01:23:43,160 --> 01:23:45,880 And it's clear that you can see it's going to be Harold. 1575 01:23:47,960 --> 01:23:48,880 Right. 1576 01:23:48,960 --> 01:23:51,800 There it is, right, that's it. 1577 01:23:51,880 --> 01:23:53,360 - [Male] Hold on hold on hold on. 1578 01:23:55,480 --> 01:23:57,840 - The tattoo you want, I gotta stay warm. 1579 01:23:57,920 --> 01:24:01,800 - [Male] That's fine, you can do that. 1580 01:24:01,880 --> 01:24:03,800 - [Jason] Who says I'm not normal? 1581 01:24:09,760 --> 01:24:10,720 - Thank you, Jason. 1582 01:24:10,800 --> 01:24:12,840 - You get to post some extras. 1583 01:24:12,920 --> 01:24:15,640 Well, you've met Harold. 1584 01:24:15,720 --> 01:24:19,400 (gentle instrumental music)